I am a child of the 80's(born in 81'). One thing you didn't address was the shift in the 80's away from what i'd call the "blackness" of 50s,60s,70s music. In those 3 decades the rhythm came from the blues;the 80s rhythm lost the "swing". There was nothing with the feel of "brown sugar" or "sex machine". And i see that same sound coming around again in this rebirth of 80's culture. There is a "soul revival" going on, but it is truly a revival. Few artists have a groove to their "modern" music. Brittle is in as it was in the 80s.

Sent by DH Bennett | 5:54 PM ET | 09-02-2008

Before, a backlash of posts defending the music from the 1980s pops up on the site, I want to lend support that the comments made on this this week's show were spot on, both for the praise and bashing of the music. Having grown up in the heart of Gen-X, I have been making the same arguments for twenty years. Often, I only hear the revisionism of the alternative bands or people's enthusiastic nostalgia, both make me feel so cynical when criticizing the music.

Sent by dave - colorado | 6:04 PM ET | 09-02-2008

Just finished listening to the show online. I thought it was funny and entertaining. It also provided some good time to reflect on how not-so-bad it was.
I had some other random thoughts while listening and cruising around on the site.
1. What happened to Project Song? I'm always looking for a new one, but it's been awhile.
2. In the spirit of Elections this year I think it would be cool to hear a show on political music, like 'Sunday Bloody Sunday' by U2 and "For What It's Worth", written by Stephen Stills and
recorded by Buffalo Springfield. What was the message?, was it received?, etc... most people would probably think of the 60's and 70's but there is something from almost every era. Just a thought.
I love the show, keep up the good work.

thanks for asking about project song, we have one soon ready to go with Chris Walla and J. Robbins...great tune...they are labor intensive and we have been a bit busy...but soon and thanks..
we've done political shows before to address your other thought...I'll try and find a way to do something interesting.

all the best

bob

Sent by Anthony Quinn | 6:23 PM ET | 09-02-2008

I love the 80s. 80s music indulged in fun. Fun is something that lots of music is missing these days. Why so serious?

Sent by tyler k. rauman | 6:59 PM ET | 09-02-2008

I heartily disagree. The 80's to me were like the 50's over again. The music was happy and fun, as opposed to the chaos of the late 60's and the schmaltz and excess of the 70's.
I mean, seriously, listen to the top songs of 1973-74 and tell me it was better than the 80's.
I'll give some examples:
"Having My Baby" - Paul Anka
"The Night Chicago Died" - Paper Lace
"Tie A Yellow Ribbon" - Tony Orlando and Dawn
I just vomited in my mouth a little bit while typing that. Ugh.
OK, "Wild Wild West" was awful but there were much better 80's songs before that.

Sent by Andrew D. Crews | 9:27 PM ET | 09-02-2008

Great show! The commentary had me laughing along the whole way. Thanks as always.

Sent by John Shook | 10:02 PM ET | 09-02-2008

I have to say that while I agree with what you said as far as the music that you DID cover, your choices of what to cover and not to cover seemed a little ethnocentric. To talk about the eighties music without even mentioning the birth of hip-hop, sampling, or the creation of turntable as instrument seems a little narrow-minded. I kept waiting for someone to mention Run DMC or Public Enemy for what they contributed to today's muscial culture, but it never happened.

Sent by kevin lane | 1:04 AM ET | 09-03-2008

Just caught the show online and loved every minute (despite the torture some of those songs inflicted - Hall & Oates? OUCH). I feel compelled to add to the list of all the things that were wrong with mainstream 80s music (synth, reverb, lack of bass, etc.) something my friend Mark has dubbed The BSS (Bad Sax Solo). Once he pointed this out to me it seemed that almost every other song on the charts at that time had one (and I believe every song by Rick Springfield).

Great job covering the good and bad in such a short time! I could easily have listened for another hour. My personal picks for good 80s music that I didn't hear mentioned include Violent Femmes, They Might Be Giants and Paul Simon's Graceland. And one of my favorite travesties that you mercifully avoided: Wham Rap! Thanks for a fun nostalgia trip.

Sent by Heather Brown | 2:08 AM ET | 09-03-2008

AC/DC' album Back in Blog compares suitably to anything they released in the seventies.

Sent by Rishi | 9:25 AM ET | 09-03-2008

A great, funny, entertaining show! These roundtable discussions always make me wish I was sitting there with you guys.

I'd always considered myself a fan of every decade EXCEPT the 80s... until recently. I credit this new acceptance to a combination of factors such as the revival of 80s culture that's been happening in the indie/hipster scene, the influence of friends who had always loved that era, and the permeation of 80s sensibilities in some of the new music today (i.e. Cut Copy).

Grunge (particularly Nirvana) was the moment of my musical awakening so my previous exposure to 80s had been limited to whatever was on TV or the movies, and it was all terrible.

Still, I've found myself listening to music of this era and not completely hating it (yes, even Hall & Oates). Of course there's stuff I always loved, like the heyday of Michael Jackson. Even then, there are some strange 80s eccentricities. (What's with the Chipmunk vocals in P.Y.T.?!)

Carrie made an interesting observation that I think is true. I can appreciate the 80s now in context of a wider scope of music. The 80s are a fun indulgence, but it'll never be my one true love.

Sent by laoser | 9:52 AM ET | 09-03-2008

Ok. I never comment on stuff, but I really have to put my very small two cents in on this show.

Where was the rap? Going by your comments that the 80's was right in the middle of the great music of the 70's and toning down of theatrics of the 90's, the 80's was the 70's of rap music. We were introduced to this new element and got to ride along with the formation of different styles within that one genre. We got to see rap used and actually fused with other great music forms.

I can't believe that the only thing remotely close that I heard was the Beastie Boys in the very beginning of the show.

I, too, came of age in the 80's. Sure the 80's was over the top in many ways and the music scene was ready for a major enema by the nineties, but there were some really ground breaking things going on, too. Where would rap be without the 80's? When the eighties ended, it seemed that I could no longer hear any music of different "genres" on the same radio station any more. I loved that in the eighties, I could listen to Duran Duran and the Doug E Fresh and Talking Heads and it was all fine.

Sent by Tylene | 10:42 AM ET | 09-03-2008

I don't want to defend the 80's as much as explain why 1983 is my favorite year for music.

I believe that for guys, their favorite music tends to be when they are around 13 years of age. I was 12 in 1983 and that is far and away my favorite year in music. It was also the year I discovered American Top 40 on the radio and was amazed at the different genres of music played that introduced me to many different genres of music.

I would say "favorite" is different from "influential" - when I hear others speak of their favorite time period, it typically is more because the period, such as the 60's was influential to the future of music.

1983 to me represented a variety of popular music - pop, rock, modern, new wave, country and R & B were all represented as #1 songs on Billboard. It's rare to find time periods in the rock era that had such variety, in my opinion.

Look at the list of artists that hit #1 that year: The Police, Michael Jackson, Irene Cara, Paul McCartney, Eurythmics, Men At Work, Lionel Richie, Bonnie Tyler, Dexy's Midnight Runners, David Bowie, Toto, Billy Joel, Michael Sembello, Dolly Parton/Kenny Rogers, James Ingram/Patti Austin.

While I can't say all of the above are my favorites, the number ones that year are still played on the radio today.

That said, I do enjoy every decade of music during the rock era, with the 90s probably ranking the lowest. I think what saves the 90s and this decade is the access we now have to a variety of music is so much greater than it ever was. I can find my favorite type of music without relying on the Pop charts to define what I listen to.

Sent by Tony | 11:36 AM ET | 09-03-2008

Great show. The worst single of the 1980s, but perhaps the best video, has to be track star Carl Lewis's single "Break It Up". Lewis looks like a beefy Grace Jones, and the video is filled with gym equipment, Carl Lewis exercising, hot tubs, the worst of 1980s workout wear, and bizarre moments, especially the surprise ending. To save your ears, you may just want to watch it with the sound off.

Sent by Michael Meyer | 11:45 AM ET | 09-03-2008

Great show! Your round-table editions are my favorites. Along with those wondering why no rap (save the Beasties) in your discussion, I am also wondering why not one mention of The Smiths or XTC? Though their popularity here never reached the heights it did in Britain, both these bands meant a lot to kids like me who thought pop music did not have to be brainless. In the case of The Smiths, I cannot think of another band so articulate in its expression of teenage longing and solitude. And XTC's Skylarking is simply a masterpiece from start to finish. Thank goodness for college radio and WFNX in Boston when I was growing up for playing these bands and so many others and saving me from hearing "Walking on Sunshine" 'round the clock!

we left out so much, rap being one of the biggest gaping holes. When we do these kind of shows I think of them more as a sit down with friends, and I don't plot out an agenda to make sure we cover all the bases. It is so different then reporting a story or writing an article...I think of these as jumping off points. Maybe we should do part 2, I'm not sure...Let's see how the comments fall.

Bob

Sent by Kim | 12:04 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Oh what a feeling
When you're dancing on the ceiling!

Sorry, couldn't resist.

I was disappointed to hear no mention of rap music. The 80's may have done much harm but at least they brought that to the mainstream. Public Enemy, BDP, DMC, LL, Slick Rick (and many others) introduced this suburban white kid to what life was like for many urban blacks. And much of it was good music.

Sent by Richard Bolster | 12:19 PM ET | 09-03-2008

What about hip-hop? As a white boy who grew up in suburban Indiana, I was greatly influenced by albums by Public Enemy, A Tribe Called Quest, De La Soul, and The Beastie Boys. Granted, it took me until the early 90s to 'catch on'. I still listen to albums such as 'It Takes a Nation of Millions...' today and they sound as powerful and vital as they did 20 odd years ago. I am fairly certain that if a white teen from Indiana was inspired by these albums, then so were countless others. I think that the late 80s and early 90s hip-hop revolution would make a great topic (w/ guest hosts) for an All Song Considered podcast. This is a genre that is often overlooked on the program. And although the current commercialization of hip-hop has given the genre a black eye, there are still many relevant, great hip-hop artists carrying on the tradition that started in the 80s. I can take or leave some of the other music from the time, but the hip-hop was fresh, raw, and revolutionary.

Sent by Paul | 12:49 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I was born in 84 and didn't really hear a lot of music until grunge. I didn't don't and never will like Nirvana. I do however LOVE most 80's music. I love pretty much ALL hair bands, I love Depeche Mode and the Cure even Flock of Seagulls. I love the poppy (I'll admit- bad) music from all the classic 80's movies. I had older brothers that, as the younger sister, I idolized and they loved the eighties so I think I just followed their lead but pretty much took it as my own once I got older and realized my brothers were just annoying.

I understand that the music is not as "deep" as the music since but it's fun. Nothing wrong with mindless fun now and then. Speaking of, I really need to go listen to G & R now... that was such a tease!

Sent by Lyndsey | 1:13 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Doveman cover of Hear it for the Boy is terrible.

Sent by Heather S. | 1:43 PM ET | 09-03-2008

What a fabulous show. A couple of thoughts:

I didn't choose the 80's because at age 9 or 10 in 1976, I convinced my Mom to buy me Kiss - Destroyer. Older brothers were "shock and awe-ing" their little brothers with the spectacle of KISS at home and at school. Kiss had to be the biggest influence on me ever. Then there was the first time I heard "Sultans of Swing" in the summer of '78. I found my self using my right forearm as a guitar neck while my left hand and my brain tried to figure out how Mark Knoffler was playing all those gorgeous notes. I have even more fond memories of The Who, David Bowie, and Rocky Horror being recorded on cassettes by sticking the deck up to the radio speaker. Nostalgia won out there.

If not for those reasons, I would have picked a year in the 80's-- probably '85 or '86. I started college after discovering punk rock as a sophomore in high school, and the Replacements and Husker Du were my mainstays. But then again, those bands and a million others I loved were not mainstream music.

Speaking of Minneapolis mega-bands... The one artist that was better in the 80's rather than the 70's was Prince! He took all of those overblown elements that you spoke of and made some of the most revolutionary music ever (pun somewhat not intended).

Sent by Mark C | 2:02 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I'm with Bob - Thank goodness for WFNX in Boston!! The 80's are my favorite decade for music, but I wasn't listening to Top 40. I was listening to alternative - The Smiths, The Cure, Sinead O'Connor, XTC, The Housemartins, The Violent Femmes, etc. Sadly, it seems that the 80's isn't remembered for those artist, but the cheesy tunes you highlighted on your show.

Sent by Jen | 2:05 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Great show, as always! You guys all have great insights into music that I've previously not considered.

I'm the same age as Carrie Brownstein, so I think I related most to her talking about how we can view the 80's as bad and cheesy and still really love it, knowing that what came before and after was so much better. Also, we were 10-12 years old, and it was almost as if the music were just as young and cheesy as WE were - and that's why it's fun to listen to it now, and pretend we're that young again. (For a little bit, that is.)

One of the best things that MTV and videos provided for me and my sister was a bigger view of the world - sure there was Madonna and Prince and Michael Jackson on every hour, but once in a while you'd get bands like They Might Be Giants, Butthole Surfers, Dead Kennedys, etc. - and you'd realize, hey, these bands are so interesting and not what I normally hear. That was the gift of MTV to us, in addition to showing us Yes, Peter Gabriel, Tom Petty and allowing us to trace back and find out that Peter Gabriel was once in Genesis, and Genesis was awesome back then.

Thanks again for the show - it's fun to think back and realize what CDs from the 80s that I still own (REM, mainly, TMBG and Tracy Chapman) and realize that hey, the stuff that was good back then is still good. Keep up the fun!

Sent by Nancy | 2:19 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I enjoyed the show and understand the way you all felt about some of those songs, but at the same time I feel that the theme was based upon a flaky assumption. Just because no one chose the 80s as their music-defining year doesn't necessarily mean that it was hated. My choice for the best year in music was 1994, but I have a soft spot for the cheesy, superficial, synth-rich music of the decade before. My guess is that there are a fair amount of people who feel the same way.

If I had to choose a decade for when popular music was at its worst, I would say we are living in it. Between the completely empty rap songs and throngs of reality-show based singers, I cannot find any value in the music that is played on the radio today. Sure the hits of the 80s were shallow, but there was a sort of genius about how crappy they were that can still be appreciated today. Maybe I'll feel that way about today's popular music 8-10 years from now, but it's not really looking that way.

Sent by AJ | 2:55 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Thanks again Bob,

You had me laughing out loud, I nearly splotchered.
I had to pause the podcast because I didn't want to miss a nanosecond when tepid coffee shot out of my nose.

I was introduced to Talking Heads and REM by a younger brother.
I was also fortunate enough to have a high school, yes high school station that played some great truly alternative rock music in the Reagan/Thatcher/Garfield Era:
Oingo Boingo, Replacements, Pschycodelic Furs, remember the Godfathers? We got kicked out of their show when they opened for Love and Rockets.

I cringed like you during Tears for Fear and Guns 'n Roses.
"Naive Melody" was a lullaby I sang to my restless baby girl, she's now 24, still restless.

Thanks again,

Norm Herrmann
Etowah, NC

Sent by Norm Herrmann | 3:34 PM ET | 09-03-2008

The reason people like 80's music aside from the nostalgia is that it is fun and easy to dance to. The songs are simple and sometimes music is just supposed to be fun. That does not make it good but it does make it stick around.

Sent by Molly D. | 3:43 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Thanks so much for your 80s music episode. I came of age during the 80s (i'm 36) and my favorite band is still Talking Heads. I think that, despite its awful contributions to popular music, that great decade was when the foundation of alternative/college music was built (a foundation started in the late 70s, sure). Thinking back to all the great music I discovered (from The Cure to Bauhaus to REM to the Smiths to New Order to the Pixies) I realize with so much chagrin that much of it was thanks to MTV's "120 Minutes" of all things! My sister and I used to stay up very late on, I think it was, Sundays to watch the show. It's embarrassing that MTV is to thank for much of my musical development early on but perhaps it makes a certain kind of twisted sense.

I'm not sure where The Police fall in terms of taste--regardless, they still hold a special place in my musical heart--but to me they scream 80s. I can't believe you neglected to mention them at all! They were my first concert (the GoGos opened).

BTW, great example of a good song ruined by synth and production, and revealed in its greatness by a cover: Tears for Fears' "Mad World" (covered brilliantly by Gary Jules).

Cheers,
Chad Woodford
San Francisco, CA (raised in Syracuse, NY)

Sent by Chad Woodford | 3:53 PM ET | 09-03-2008

As a 39 year old music professional I sometimes lament that I had to come of age in the 1980s instead of the 50s, 60s, or 70s. Luckily from a random review in Rolling Stones in 1986 I purchased a cassette of Husker Du's Candy Apple Grey which led me to other artists such as Husker Du, Sonic Youth, Minute Men, Black Flag, Replacements, Dead Kennedys etc. I was always repelled by the popier side of 80s music, but I have to admit that I was sucked in by Duran Duran, Psychedelic Furs, the Fixx, and other keyboard laced mullet wearing English groups. But with all that said you are still wrong about Hall and Oats. Although completely overproduced on the original recordings, stripped down these songs are brilliant pieces of rock Americana. Check out Live from Daryl's House on line for proof positive. And no I have nothing professionally to do with this site or Daryl Hall's music, just a geek fan.

Sent by Michael Cusanelli | 3:53 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Paul Simon did his best work in the 80s with "Graceland." Although, as Bob would note, the post-production at the Hit Factory did indeed indulge in some excessive digital reverb--listen to the snare drum!

Sent by Rich from Austin | 3:54 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Hello,
I loved the program. I was a young adult in the 80's (I'm 47 now) and played in a band. Although I enjoyed the show, you didn't mention many of the English bands that actually did interesting things with synths like New Order and Ultravox. New Order had the definitive synth dance song with Blue Monday. It had incredible programming and arrangement and it still sounds good today. There were also the dark, pre-Goth bands like Bauhaus, Siouxsie & The Banshees, Theatre of Hate and the Cure. The Cure especially used synths that sounded very organic when mixed with their more traditional instruments. Bauhaus had some incredible records that sounded like nothing else at the time and still hold up today.
If you stick to what was popular and on MTV, the 80s definitely sucked. But if you went a little deeper underground, like you mentioned on your program, there was a lot of innovative stuff going on.
By the way, the Talking Heads' best record, Remain In Light, had a ground-breaking sound which combined African rhythms with their quirky dance music.

Thanks for reading,
Oscar Herrera
Miami, FL

Sent by Oscar Herrera | 3:58 PM ET | 09-03-2008

The '80s: Were They Really That Bad?

If readers were judging by the list of listening samples provided ("Let's Hear it For the Boy" twice??), I'd be inclined to say so.
Like every decade, the 80's produced it's share of cultural pap but it also was the decade of Prince, Michael Jackson (when he was about music & dance) and the advent of some pretty damn good electronic music (Devo, Kraftwerk, Howard Jones, New Order, etc.). Personally, I really liked some of the "hair bands" of metal: Scorpions, Iron Maiden, early Metallica, etc. The 1980's music lacked the folk sensitivity and soul of the 70's but there really were too many innovations and contributions to ignore.

Sent by Seth Basen | 4:01 PM ET | 09-03-2008

All Songs folks,

I really enjoyed the 80s-centered show.

Of course you can't get all of the best and the worst of the 80s in a half-hour broadcast, but I can't believe no one mentioned the king of the 80s: Huey Lewis and the News. Was anyone flying the flag of the 80s more than he was? And as soon as the 80s ended, he disappeared. Man did that band suck although I have to admit I enjoyed some of it as a young teenager, but not so much as a 36-year-old today.

I saw them once in the mid-1990s in an outdoor amphitheater and I'll never forget how Huey introduced one of his hits in the middle of the show. He looked out at the (modest) crowd and said in a conversational yet downtrodden tone: "You know, some say the old dog is barely breathing." Pause. Then the party started: "But I'm here to tell you, the heart of rock and roll is still beating!!" I cringed so hard I hurt my back.

But there really was a sizeable chunk of worthwhile music. For starters:
Metallica (and the non-hair metal): especially and Justice For All--the thinking man's metal album.
Men At Work
Dead Kennedys
Camper Van Beethoven
They Might Be Giants (their first two records are BRILLIANT and sound like nothing else)
Talking Heads: Probably my favorite song of all time is Road to Nowhere. It's like we're all going to die but have a hell of a time on the way.

Special praise should be reserved for the best song of the decade: Cars by Gary Numan. Sure, it has the synths and all that but it still packs a punch. My friend's band used to do a great guitar-driven cover of it to close their show.

Another band who excelled in the 70s and did not in the 80s: Pink Floyd.

Doug Trapp

Sent by Doug Trapp | 4:05 PM ET | 09-03-2008

It was a little odd not to hear U2 mentioned in an 80s retrospective.

The program was rather long, so maybe I missed the name drop, but I'm pretty sure there wasn't any U2 played.

Of course, I see U2 mentioned in the text preceding these comments . . .

On a personal note, I can't decide whether U2 had (has) a timeless sound that transcends the 80s (which would make their exclusion from the program acceptable), or whether they perfected an 80s sound in a way that's kept the songs relevant (which would make their exclusion a crime). Witness the Edge's shimmery guitar, Bono's arena lyrics and vocals, etc.

Sent by Nathan Spears | 4:05 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Whoa Folks!

You missed some of the most talented and influential bands of the eighties that spawned the grunge and glory of the nineties! Anybody who doesn't think the 80s had anything to offer needs to flip back through their albums some of the greatest music of the last generation. From the British Isles you had the raw sound of The Jesus & Mary Chain and the pop sensibilities of The Smiths; in Olympia, WA Calvin Johnson & Beat Happening was birthing Twee Pop and K Records; and on the East Coast Sonic Youth, Dinosaur Jr. and The Pixies were throwing together unique sounds that had never been heard before!

I'd say the eighties were one of the greatest periods for music of all time - it was the boiling pot of wonderful things to come... when talented bands started to ditch the mainstream and independent labels became the wave of the future. The nineties may have been the high water mark of this trend but surely you have to give the eighties its do.

Just my humble opinion :-)

Sent by Dan | 4:28 PM ET | 09-03-2008

The 80s - The Pixies and Metal.

Dear All Songs Considered,

Let me begin this short email by letting you know two things. First, that I am an avid listener and fan of NPR. Second, that I have never written to a radio, tv, or film studio to comment on content.

It seems almost a crime that all of you neglected to mention The Pixies. The influence that The Pixies had on so many subsequent bands is simply staggering. They were fresh, new and inventive.

While you did mention 'butt rock' and 'hair metal', you seemed to neglect the 'rest' of the metal scene. The 80s ushered in a huge era of metal that influenced all of heavy music to this day. The significance of the New Wave of British Heavy Metal cannot be ignored. This scene shed light on Iron Maiden with fantastic records like Number of the Beast. Bands from the 'NWOBHM' heavily influenced bands like Megadeth, Metallica, Slayer, who's contribution to heavy music must be recognized. These are only a few of some truly creative bands in the heavy metal genre that made waves and moved music forward.

If the program was only about top 40, it would be easier to dismiss these bands being overlooked. However, your hosts did pick a few fringe bands. I was smiling ear to ear when you were discussing Minor Threat. I thought for sure that part of the discussion would be a gateway to talk about more fringe, or underground music.

It's not the dismissal of particular bands that's disappointing. It's neglecting a whole movement.

All the best,

-drp-

Sent by David | 4:29 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Dear Idiots ;),

You didn't talk about the best song and artist of that decade in my book. Of course I was listening to some hole-in-the-wall college stations back in the day.

The Replacements and Tracy Chapman were a couple of the few raw sounds on the charts during the worst recent decade of popular music.

But though you briefly discussed the impact of video on your reactions to the music of the 80's, you missed what for me was the standout song and video production of that decade.

Please give a listen, sans preconceptions: http://tinyurl.com/6hcnqm

For me, the sparse, tasteful instrumentation could almost be of any recent decade (other than the 80's). The video is also timeless--could be shot today.

thank you, we laughed out loud - rh

Sent by Adrian near Seattle | 4:37 PM ET | 09-03-2008

What a bunch of snobs who have totally missed the point. The eighties have mass elements of cheese and can drown you in synths, but the musicianship is significantly better than anything that came out later on the pop scene. This was the beginning of the end for people who new how to play their instruments. Yes, they experimented...just like Frampton comes alive did in the 70's. Soon after the eighties, music has been reduced to people who don't know how to play their instruments, sequencers programmed by producers and rip off hacks. The eighties offered niches for everyone. It was when alternative was really an alternative. Punk music was made by people who still new why punk was started. Underground was underground because it wasn't picked up by major labels, not like today where it's not picked up because nobody wants to hear it. Every decade has had its dose of cheesy bubblegum. I am sure that you could pick out hundreds of songs from the seventies and sixties that make you wonder what the artists and producer were thinking. I know that I have thought it for a vast majority of music produced after 1996. It was much easier to find song to relate to in the eighties. Now its all the same crybaby, fake gangsta, mommy doesn't love me garbage.

Sent by MB | 4:57 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I don't want to include the force-feeding of music played at the Ahhs! gift store in Westwood, which included David Bowie's Let's Dance, Michael Jackson's Thriller and Off the Wall, Marshall Crenshaw, Police's Synchronicity, etc

gag.

I cleared my head by listening to KCRW's Morning Becomes Eclectic, Snap (hosted by the late Dierdre O'Donahue), Reggae Beat, African Beat, and other shows.

But the vinyl I spun included Peter Gabriel, Kate Bush, Laurie Anderson, The Talking Heads, The Greatful Dead (well, not their studio work, though, so I guess that doesn't count). I listened to Paul Simon's Graceland, The Neville Brother's Yellow Moon, Pink Floyd's The Wall.

There is a pattern here. I pretty much avoided popular music. The more I heard it on commercial radio, the more I changed the channel.

I grew up in L.A. and now that I live in Northern California, thank goodness for Internet radio, because there is nothing around here I can receive that I can tolerate. Therefore, Pandora.com and Radioparadise.com, thank you!

Sent by Jerald in the Silicon Valley | 5:23 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Thanks for the 80s show, it brought back a lot of memories, good and bad.

I graduated in 1991 so I was right in the thick of the mid to late 80s music scene. Even though I grew up in the Twin Cities, I was still very sheltered in what I got to listen to, mostly Top 40. That makes me quite sad, looking back, I missed a lot that happened right under my nose in Minneapolis.

Also wanted to thank you for leaving the outro on the podcast, that was quite entertaining, sounded a lot like some of the conversations I have had with my friends over the years.

Thanks again!

Sent by Tony | 5:39 PM ET | 09-03-2008

So, like maybe you need to have someone else in your group that knows about music of color......

Sent by Amy | 5:55 PM ET | 09-03-2008

No Dinosaur Jr? No H??sker D??? No Pixies? No Eric B & Rakim? No Michael
Jackson? No JAMC? No XTC?

CMON GUYS!! The terrible long tail verb on snares is there and yes,
it's hilarious but there was plenty of great music in the 1980s.

1985 was a great year for music. The Pixies formed. Dinosaur was
released. Psychocandy was released. And 1987. You're Living All Over
Me. Come On Pilgrim.

You guys missed a whole lot of great stuff.

Sent by Colin Barrett | 6:05 PM ET | 09-03-2008

You asked for comments as to why people are so defensive of 80s pop music. I think you guys managed to touch on it, but the majority of the music just felt good. It certainly isn't anywhere near as good as a lot of other music. I wouldn't listen to a whole Tears For Fears album multiple times a week, but I wouldn't hesitate to do that with Arcade Fire.

80s music is JFK. His presidency was short, largely unsuccessful, marred by scandal and filled with gaffes, but when he spoke it strired something in us. He wasn't good at his job, but listening to him speak felt good. And with the music in the 90s taking such a quick turn to depressing themes, its not surprising the nostalgia that we feel for this music that isn't that well executed. It's chocolate. It feels nice in moderation.

Sent by Ben | 6:33 PM ET | 09-03-2008

NO PRINCE!? No mention at all of Prince? Main stream 80's music still influencing bands today? Everyone says Prince! I can't believe it.

Sent by Michael Storc | 6:35 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I really enjoyed the episode about the '80s with the retrospective discussion amongst the four music experts. I would love to hear a second part to it where you could address all of the music that the four of you mentioned at the end that you couldn't get to. I was also expecting to hear someone bring up The Cure and Sonic Youth and was a bit surprised at their omissions, although I understand it is difficult to cram a whole decade into a podcast under an hour long. So, perhaps a second installment? Hope so.

Sent by adam | 6:40 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Q: Was there anybody in the 80s who put out a record that was better than the records they put out in the 70s?

A: Tom Waits. ("Swordfishtrombones" and "Rain Dogs"...great records.)

Sent by Gareth Tucker | 6:52 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I loved the "80's worst show" and passed the podcast link to several friends and co-workers.

The fun you had making the show is infectious. I'm surprised to see so many negative posts. Have a bit of humor, and some perspective.

Sent by Blair | 6:54 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I started to write this before the end of your story when you finally gave the underground music scene a mention. The 80's were an incredibly thriving and extraordinary time for music but those who were watching Madonna at home on MTV missed it. The bad music you're talking about when videos and commerce took over music was not what was really happening in the 80's. The garage bands of the 60's, bands like the MC5 and Iggy and the Stooges gave way to punk. Punk in the late 70's was a reaction against the big over produced stuff and spawned a huge underground that had absolutely no support except by their own community. In the 80's every town all over America and Europe and beyond had people that took it into their own hands to make music, record music, promote events, booked their own tours and produce magazines about this underground scene.That's the music that was comparable to what happened in the 60's before the industry started to put looks and lip syncing above everything else. That's why they had the audacity to put stand-ins in the videos instead of the less photogenic actual singers. XTC, Joy Division, Wire, Minutemen, Husker du, Meat Puppets, REM, Sonic Youth are the bigger names I can think of and there were other smaller national acts and local acts that were really good. Grunge really began there as well as other off shoots of music that are impossible to pigeon hole. There was Hard Core, that has been documented to some extent but also a much more varied kind of music. Bands like Nirvana and later the White Stripes came out of that groundwork. They didn't appear in a vacuum. I hope in the future you can cover THAT 80's. That was my 80's and the majority of that work is evaporating. Sad that the Don Johnson "music" and that ilk will be preserved instead.

Sent by Diana from Detroit | 7:02 PM ET | 09-03-2008

I disagree that 80s music was bad, but maybe I was just lucky to grow up with a good radio station or two. Just a few observations:

- U2's "Joshua Tree" was only mentioned as an afterthought, but the music that came before was just as good (listen to or watch Under a Blood Red Sky for some awesome examples).
- Tears for Fears had a lot of good stuff besides "Head Over Heels" ("Woman in Chains," "Mad World," "Pale Shelter") even if you couldn't dance to their music - but unless you danced in the 80s you might not have known how good INXS or Duran Duran or Pet Shop Boys or Billy Idol were.
- Simple Minds was more than just music in a John Hughes film - listen to their earlier new wave-ish sound in "Waterfront" or "Up On the Catwalk."
- And let's not forget Ska! English Beat/General Public, UB40, Madness.
- Or how about Oingo Boingo ("Nothing Bad Ever Happens" and "Who Do You Want To Be?").
- And there are plenty of us who still love the upbeat music of Howard Jones - my kids are now fans after attending a concert of his this summer. In fact, I'd bet you'd find lots of those little "musical gems" in the New Wave synth music from the early 80s that you dismissed so easily (how about the instrumental "DNA" or "It's Not Me Talking" or "European" by A Flock of Seagulls).

Musical tastes are personal. Personally - and many will find it heretical - I don't like the Beatles. I finally grew to appreciate the lyrics of Tracy Chapman's "Fast Car" but people roll their eyes when I admit that. I didn't see what was so great about your song by The Replacements and couldn't understand your obsession with bands from the 70s like Black Sabbath or the Eagles ("Hotel California" makes me want to kill myself as does just about anything by Pink Floyd!). But that's the great thing about music - there's something for everyone - and the 80s had plenty of variety, maybe more than the decades before or since. In my opinion it was a breath of fresh air after the 70s. Granted, the hair and clothing styles were over the top, but at least the clothes they wore were clean - unlike the 70s and 90s!

Sent by John (class of '85) | 7:21 PM ET | 09-03-2008

As I'm pretty much the same age as Carrie Brownstein, I lived through the decade of 80s music. It was great to listen to your discussion - and all of the giggles.

Anyway, the selection of songs is some of my favorite songs of the 80s and my least favorite songs of the 80s. My babysitters loved Talking Heads, while I was more of a Tears for Fears kid. I do love We Built This City by Starship but I grew up in the San Francisco Bay Area in the 1980s. The entire Footloose soundtrack is a hoot. I love Fast Car by Tracy Chapman. And Paradise City by Guns and Roses - brings back memories from when my husband and I were in graduate school at Michigan in the early 2000s. We had to drive 30 miles to our house in the country from Ann Arbor, we'd put this song on just so that we hit the really curvy part of the road right when the thrasher part of the song came on. Who knew that I would do this to Paradise City when it came out when I was in 8th grade! What a classic from the 80s.

Thanks for the exposure on the 80s music. 90s should be next - some great highs and lows in that decade as well.

Sent by Annie Dowling | 7:39 PM ET | 09-03-2008

When my friends and I started getting satellite radios, they all started gravitating towards the 80's channels. I was confused, because my main memories of the 80's, as I have often proclaimed to my friends, was "Let's hear It for the Boy" on an endless loop.

Your show made me want to defend some parts of the 80's. It was sad that you didn't mention anything about rap - Sugarhill Records with the house band of Doug Wimbush, Keith LeBlanc etc., Profile records, Tommy Boy records, Def Jam, etc. The indies were where it was at in all genres. Rap n the 80's was GREAT, there was a new style almost every week. De La Soul, Public Enemey, 3rd Bass, LL Cool J, Beastie Boys, Grandmater Flash, etc.

On the rock side, there was Sonic Youth's EVOL, the whole SST records crew (Meat Puppets, Minutemen, Husker Du), The stuff coming out of Chicago, etc.

Hey, ever heard of a guy named Prince?

You touched on the Post-Punk and the New Zealand scenes, but what about Joy Division/New Order, Factory records, Rough Trade, all of the great British stuff making the rounds?

Ever heard of The Clash? Sandanista maybe?

Didn't "Remain in Light" come out on the 80's? Atomic Dog, lots of George Clinton solo stuff that was great.

You guys didn't mention any black artists except the Bad Brains - who were one of the greatest bands ever - but weren't exactly playing R & B.

What about Country Music? Merle Haggard put out some of his best work in the 80's, when a country artist was still releasing 3 albums a year. Then there's Dwight Yoakam, Randy Travis, Ricky Skaggs, George Strait, Steve Earle, Lyle Lovett, George Jones, LOTS of country artists doing their greatest work in the 80's.

What about reggae? Sly and Robbie, Black Uhuru, Burning Spear, Steel Pulse...

The mainstream stuff in the 80's was 90 percent garbage, but just like any era the mainstream stuff is rarely the great stuff. Just look at a singles chart from 1968 to see Englebert Humperdink duking it out with the Beatles.

Lee Harris
host of The Lee Show Tuesdays 9-11 Pm
www.wrir.org

Sent by Lee | 7:42 PM ET | 09-03-2008

One of my favorite albums is from 1985, Kate Bush's "Hounds of Love." In the last 23 years I must have listened to it hundreds of times, and it always sounds complex, fresh, original, and beautiful. I get new meanings from her lyrics now, in my forties, that I did not understand in my twenties. Oh, and I felt that my love of this album was endorsed when, in 1990, a well-known music reviewer put it on his list of top ten albums of the 80's.

Sent by Pam | 8:19 PM ET | 09-03-2008

1984 alone was one of the best years in music. Period.
There were breakout albums across genres that will go down in history - here are a few

Purple Rain
Thriller
Born in the USA
Talking Heads
Tears for Fears
the return of Tina Turner
The Cure
U2 (or actually 84 might have been the year between New Years Day and Unforgettable Fire)
The English Beat
Madonna's debut album
Cyndi Lauper

Not t mention the surge of alternative New Wave and Punk that filled the airwaves. I couldn't disagree more. Maybe the NPR listeners are still a majority of weenie babyboomers.

Sent by stefanie | 9:42 PM ET | 09-03-2008

You are totally right about the main issues of the 80's. Bad synths and drums really dehumanized music. The bad production created music that grates and is hard to tolerate repetitively. And your discussion of nostalgia and context was also right on. You mentioned that some music was actually good, but basically claimed that nothing really seminal came out.

Well, you made one major, obvious ommission in the discussion:
What about Paul Simon's Graceland album?? It had wonderful, dynamic human performances (not synths!), it popularized world-fusion nearly on its own, and it remains today one of the very greatest albums of all time. And it's not an obscure title you found out about later. It was #3 Billboard album in 1986.

Update: I see someone else mentioned this one, but I actually wrote this to the e-mail, and was asked to add to the blog comments, so here it is.

Sent by Aaron | 10:57 PM ET | 09-03-2008

1. The 80's had some poor music. I nominate anything by Sheena Easton, especially "Morning Train."

2. I just think that "Brilliant Disguise" is a brave song that an artist made while his marriage was breaking up:

Well I've tried so hard baby but I just can't see
What a woman like you is doing with me.
So tell me what I see when I look in your eyes
Is that you baby or just a brilliant disguise

3. While I don't like "We Built This City," I just don't think it's the worst. Sheena Easton and the Footloose songs and maybe some Van Halen seem much more annoying to me. Not so much a defense of Starship as "it's as bad as..." statement.

Sent by NJTom | 11:02 PM ET | 09-03-2008

Dianna from Detroit, you hit the nail on the head. The underground scene in the 80s was rich! Minutemen and H??sker D??. These were fantastic 80s bands that seemed to exist in a separate universe from much of what was played on the radio.

Sent by Stephen Randall in Denver | 12:34 AM ET | 09-04-2008

C'mon, are you kidding? I love All Songs Considered, but were those really the best songs you could pick from the 80's? I suppose I wouldn't be too impressed with the musical fruits of the decade, either, if the range were as narrow as Hall & Oates to Don Johnson to Springsteen (as great as he is). You mentioned hair bands, and the best you could come up with was Guns 'n Roses? Haha, I know you're pressed for time and can't choose one of everything, but let's examine some of the finer points of the 80s' legacy, many of which have already been pointed out by astute posters above:

Punk, New Wave, hip-hop, electronica, and world music are just a few things which developed (or audibly shifted into something new) in the 80's. Great artists such as Kate Bush, Paul Simon, The Cure, The Ocean Blue, Annie Lennox/The Eurythmics, Fishbone, the (highly debated) return of Pink Floyd, Cyndi Lauper, Run DMC, Bruce Hornsby, Madonna, Dire Straits, The Smiths, Tom Petty, well...you get the point.

I could go on and on, but the point is that the voices of all of the above can be heard in much, if not most, of the music today. If influence isn't proof of greatness in art, I don't know what is. Granted, many of the decade's treasures are hidden on b-sides or in obscure soundtracks, but what a treasure trove it is! The 80's clearly rule, dude. ;)

Sent by Julia G | 2:28 AM ET | 09-04-2008

I also agree with the above. I don't think the footloose soundrack represents anything memorable about the 80s and has more to do w/ Hollywood in the 80s than music.

why didn't you list. New order, siouxsie and the banshees, the smiiths - my god, the smiths. yes. come on

Sent by stefanie | 6:34 AM ET | 09-04-2008

Well done with the 80s show! I graduated high school in 88. Man, I didn't realize the hits were so non-stop miserable until you played the songs you played today. How did we get it so wrong?? I have to ask though, where was the rap / hip-hop? You started off with Beastie Boys so I thought you were going to play some. Where was Public Enemy? How about Violent Femmes, Pixies, and Tom Waits?

Thank you for playing Talking Heads. Great pick.

As you mentioned, the 80's did seem like the place good 70's bands went to die. Ah well. I will always have a fondness for my first 45... Men At Work's Down Under. Classic 80's!

Keep up the good work!

Sent by Ozzo | 7:02 AM ET | 09-04-2008

Off of the top of my head, Devo, Peter Gabriel, and The Talking Heads all existed in the '70s and in my opinion got better in the '80s.

Also, I am only 26 minutes into your podcast but no mention of Hip Hop/Rap?

I thought you were going to badmouth "Wild Wild West" by Kool Moe Dee for a minute there. Had that been the case, then I would fight you.

Good day,
Matt G.
Southampton, UK

Sent by Matt G. | 7:42 AM ET | 09-04-2008

Thanks for the show. I'm a big fan, usually. But, I had a hard time hearing the music with which I grew up being laughed at, for the most part. Synth, over-production, whatever--I love this stuff! I also love a good bowl of ice cream. I couldn't live on the stuff, but damn if it doesn't taste like heaven at the time.

You ended the show with mentions of all sorts of stuff you did not cover in the show, which all led me to recall what a boon the 80s were to one-hit wonders. Hardly a week goes by that I do not listen to a few songs from one of the five discs in the Living in Oblivion collection (I'm sure I got this with my BMG membership back in the 90s; it's a collection of 80s one-hit wonders, and even includes the Spanish version of Toni Basil's "Mickey"--"Oh Mickey, como estas, como estas..."). If you decide to do a show like this again, you should give a nod to the plethora of one-hit wonders. I'd love to hear Dexy's Midnight Runners' "Come on Eileen" find its way to All Songs Considered.

Also, I notice the picture of Twisted Sister on the web page is most prominent; yet, no mention of them in the show. You'll use their over-the-top look for promotion, but not give "Smokin in the Boys Room" a listen?

Sent by Chris | 10:03 AM ET | 09-04-2008

Hey, I'm an NPR listener, and I think that the 80's had GREAT music! It did have quite a bit of schlock, but what decade doesn't? I was definitely a metal chick (Guns, Metallica, Ozzy, King Diamond, Motorhead, Priest, you name it, I loved it - except for bands like Great White and Winger), but also loved Tracy Chapman, R.E.M., U2, Janet Jackson, Stevie Ray Vaughn...

I think whoever says that 80's music was bad was only listening to pop radio and New Wave (what's worse than Katrina and the Waves, or Michael Jackson, or Wham?).

IMHO!

Sent by Jessica Cutts | 10:06 AM ET | 09-04-2008

The songs not considered on your show were rap. Yes, it "debuted" in 1979, but expanded across the nation and developed in the 80s. I was 17-18 in 1988-89. My memories contain Public Enemy, KRS-One, De La Soul and Yo! MTV Raps

It was a time in which rap started to broaden its message and flow about all aspects of life, not just catchy sing-songy rhyme. Eightys rap laid the groundwork for later groups like NWA and Tribe Called Quest. Pop music, to this day, can't shake the influence of eightys rap.

Please re-consider the 80s with rap.

Sent by Portia | 10:19 AM ET | 09-04-2008

The podcast and above comments are interesting...I think people forget that there was much more music segregation in the 80s than in ensuing decades. Top 40 stations only played pop, "rock" stations only played hard rock and metal, "urban" stations only played R&B and this new rap thing - and nothing really bled over. I listened to WHFS in DC in the 80s - when the station would come in on my crappy clock radio - but none of that stuff (what we think of as "the good stuff" now) really made it onto the pop charts. I never expected to hear The Smiths, The Cure, New Order, etc. on Top 40 stations.

That said, there was some great pop music in the 80s as well, as people above have mentioned. I finally came out as a non-ironic Journey fan not too long ago. And Michael Jackson and Prince's influence can't be overstated.

The 70s and 90s snobbery on the podcast amuses me, though, because you can find just as much crap from those decades as from the 80s. And much of it - just like Don Johnson and Deniece Williams - was on the Top 40 charts.

Cheers,
Martha

Sent by Martha | 10:23 AM ET | 09-04-2008

I think that there is a good case that the worst music of the 80's is worse than any other decade. But you can also argue that the best music of the 80's is better than any other decade as well.

If having the best music of the 80's means having to have the worst music of the 80's, I'll still take it.

By the way, "When Doves Cry" is often lauded for the innovation of a complete lack of a bass track, so you might want to ease up on the DX7 bashing a little. I actually think that the reason that much 80's Top 40 material was light on bass was that the average car stereo and boom boxes back then didn't have the same capability to handle true bass content compared to what you see today.

Sent by Wilbur Pan | 11:08 AM ET | 09-04-2008

I haven't read everyone's comments here but it does seem that this particular program overlooked the fact that much of what has happened in both popular, and avante-garde, or independant music, in the decades following the 80's found its inspiration in music of the eightites. Many listeners have already touched on the birth of rap, but I do need to take a moment to plug some of my favorites. Can me have a moment's silence for Slick Rick, Kool G Rap, and Eric B & Rakim please?
But its not just hip hop that owes much to the eighties, would the 90's alternative music explosion (or say Nirvana)have happened without, oh I don't know... The Misfits, Minor Threat, Black Flag, Bad Brains,the Melvins, Jane's Addiction, most of waht was released on SST, etc, ad infinitum ad nauseun. Could there have ever been say a Marilyn Manson, had there not first been Wax Trax?
And,as a final note, it is worth mentioning that most modern electronica, dj work, or dance music owes a great deal to the eighties, both to pioneering dj's and those horrible, horrible, synths. The more self aware dj's (Cut Chemist and DJ Shadow spring to mind first here) readily acknkowledge this.
Yes, most 80's pop music was regretable. The underground, however, remained vibrant, diverse, and proved ultimately to be highly, highly influential.

Sent by Sebastian Pacheco | 12:18 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Also in response to the challenge of finding an artist whose 80's output was better than their 70's work: Tom Waits.
Personally, I don't think that either his persona or music were fully developed until the release of Swordfish Trombones, and really, let's face it, Rain Dogs is just one of the best albums ever irrespective of one's personal musical tastes.

Sent by Sebastian Pacheco | 1:55 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Just listened to the show online. I think the 80s were not really that bad. Yes you had a lot of over the top music combined with videos on MTV. I'd forgotten about the Don Johnson record. This was the business model that records companies followed, but there was still really great music out there. Like others I'm surprised no one mentioned U2. 1984 marked the band's teaming up with Eno and Lanois and they produced a very different sound compared to their albums before. I graduated high school in 1987 and Joshua Tree was all I ever heard in the dorms my freshman year of college. My wife (a total pop 80s person) just listened to Joshua Tree two months ago and was very impressed. Thanks for mentioning Peter Gabriel as well. I listended to the "So" album an entire summer in 1986. The early 80s were the time I started really listening to music and I went into the progressive rock genre of Rush and Yes. Around the mid 80s I expanded my horizons and listened to Tears for Fears and saw REM a couple of times in concert. Other friends listened to the Smiths, the Cure, Run DMC, the Minutemen, and 7 Seconds. As far as artists who made good music in the 70s and didn't in the 80s I offer David Bowie's "Let's Dance" album. Very catchy, good songwriting ("Blue Jean" with Iggy Pop), great musicians (Stevie Ray Vaughn on guitar). Thanks for playing the Guns and Roses and Tears for Fears. I think every teenager who had crush saw that Tears for Fears video and saw themselves in it.

Sent by Tom Caldwell | 2:59 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Wow I love synth. Piano is better but synth is great in its own way. I think the influence of video games shaped the love of synth. You can see that influence today in bands and DJs that imitate or actually use those early Nintendo sounds (eg Anamanaguchi, RAC and Sportsday Megaphone).

But even if you hate synth, there is much to appreciate from the 80s. Every song on the Violent Femmes self-title album is fantastic. And no mention of the Pixies? The Cars had some fantastic albums and great production too. Rolling Stones were still rolling out qualitiy tunes. Squeeze. The Eurythemics. Elvis Costello. They Might Be Giants. And let's not forget the Clash!
My point is not that the 80s were superlative. Rather, I am uncomfortable with the idea that any genre or time period was inherently band. Mainly because the passion for music and art is part of every community and time---indeed, it is built into the very fabric of culture. And within that culture there will be a spectrum of quality. I gaurantee that there will a generation that looks back at the times we live in now with disgust and cynicism, as civilization continues to reinvent itself.

Sent by daretoeatapeach | 3:51 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Nice show! I love these round table discussions.

Things worth mentioning to me right off the top of my head: rap (of course), Michael Jackson's Thriller and The Police which are all definitely a huge part of great music in the 80s.

I think it's interesting that a lot of indie-electronic artists today are using a lot of these sounds that we all hated in the 80s to make music that people actually love now. I can't say that I'm a huge fan, but I can see why some people are fond of it. I wonder what the big difference in production is... just reverb?

Sent by Beth | 4:01 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Where's the metal? Glad you covered the DC hardcore scene, but no mention of any Heavy Metal? GnR was as close as you got, and they're not even Metal. What about Metallica's first 3 albums? Early Megadeth? Iron Maiden and the whole New Wave of British Heavy Metal scene, Venom, Motorhead? That's just mentioning a few. Maybe you have to be a metalhead to appreciate it, but in the context of Metal, alot of seminal and transformative artists and albums came out in the 80's.

Sent by DC | 5:39 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Dear Bob,

I was just astonished at the insensibility of your podcast on the 80's. I must disclose that, (i) I am a fan of the podcast, and (ii) I have a very very soft spot for the 80's. And in general I agree with a lot of what was said, mainly the production excess, but there was just so much left out of the podcast. Luckily Carrie Brownstein remembered the Go-Betweens, thanks for that.
I realize you cannot mention every single thing, but is there really an excuse for forgetting The Smiths? Wasn't that a pivotal time in pop music history? The Smiths were just timeless and I believe that their influence has been enduring.

And then there was the whole group of very poppy bands that have definitely influenced very directly a lot of great music made in the earlier years of the 2000's (namely under the banner of electronica, electro or electro-pop). Just to name a few:
-Depeche Mode
-Soft Cell
-New Order
-Bronski Beat
-Yazoo (or Yaz in the US)
-D.A.F.

Especially relevant, I believe, are Depeche Mode. I think that they really show how the production excess of the 80's has resulted, sometimes, in magnificent songs that survive the test of time. Actually, Depeche Mode used all the excesses of the 80's to move the field forward, innovate and create new avenues of sound that only rarely happen. Good examples are the albums Music for the Masses (1987) and Violator (1990).

Finally I would like to mention some of the great music from the post-punk/goth movement. Although I recognize, a lot of it hasn't aged very well:
-Joy Division (1979 and 1980)
-Bauhaus
-Siouxie and the Banshees
-Gang of Four (briefly mentioned by you)
-David Sylvian
-Echo and the Bunnymen
-This Mortal Coil
-Dead Can Dance
-Cocteau Twins
-The Cure
-Psychedelic Furs

All and all, I love the podcast and I guess that that was the reason that prompted me to write this email. I just expected to at least have The Smiths, New Order, Depeche Mode, Joy Division and Soft Cell acknowledged.

By the way I was born in 1978 and must admit that Music for the Masses by Depeche Mode changed my life (at 10).

Armando



Sorry Armando, we had too much fun and got carried away.
We obviously know we left out a lot, but then again we are glad to hear folks tell us about the bands we didn???t mention that meant a lot.
We didn???t do a thorough job, but had we done a better job we still would have left out a hundred bands.

all the best

Bob

Sent by Armando Geraldes | 6:37 PM ET | 09-04-2008

No Police? No Prince?

Sent by JM | 7:57 PM ET | 09-04-2008

What a horrible show. To be honest I didn't make it through the entire thing. Listening to the snobbery literally made me sick to my stomach. Someone mentioned this earlier, and I agree, that you could pick music for the 70s and 90s that is just as bad. Anyway, I don't post many comments but, wow, I just had to say something. All Songs was already starting to bother me with the constant Bon Iver mentions, now, I don't know. I just wanted to say how disappointed I am. First they cancel the Bryant Park Project then this. If NPR really wants to attract younger listeners, they're doing it wrong.

We were just trying to have some fun with it. Any perceived snobbery certainly wasn't intentional. There's a ton of great music to love from the '80s and we tried to include as much as we could in a very short time. -- rh

Sent by molly | 8:10 PM ET | 09-04-2008

This episode had me rolling! I was in high school and college during the tail end of the 80's (graduated college in 90) so I definitely came of age all through the decade.

Props to Carrie for giving the Replacements their due. I grew up in suburban Detroit and commercial radio was plagued with "hard" rock of the worst kind or really bad R&B. I was exposed to the brilliance of the 'Mats by a friend's older brother and there was no looking back after that. All my Van Halen and Whitesnake and ZZ Top (bad, MTV era) albums, yes ALBUMS, paled in comparison to the raw energy of the Replacements' "Let It Be." I even had the high privilege of seeing them live in Ann Arbor when Bob Stinson was still sloppily playing lead guitar. And "Tim" is nothing short of brilliant lyrics and memorable hooks. In fact, the Minneapolis scene of the Replacements, Husker Du and Soul Asylum was putting out a vibrant and original voice to combat the schlock found on MTV.

Other seminal moments from my musical awakening:
1) Hearing the Talking Heads' "Swamp" in my cousin's bedroom. It was like all the possibilities opened up... "you mean you're allowed to sing like that and be weird?"

2) The first time I heard the Pixies was a friend's copy of Surfer Rosa; mind blowing for the time and still holds up to anything, at any time.

How could you not mention the Police? Prince? The Cure? For all their commercial success, they still made some amazing music. Same goes for Jane's Addiction (since '85). Same goes for Uncle Tupelo (since '87) since that group spawned both Son Volt and Wilco.

I'm sure you're getting many passionate emails from listeners. I'll go on record as saying this was a great podcast and we indeed built this city on rock and roll. Still laughing about that one...

Cheers,
Tim

Sent by Tim Letscher | 9:06 PM ET | 09-04-2008

Thank you for this episode. I greatly enjoyed it. I just want to make three points.

First, when discussing major musical developments during the 80's, there were two things you missed: 1. The birth of hip hop and 2. The birth of house / electronic dance - music. Both were ground-breaking, and by the end of the 80's, it was already evident that these styles were going to have a huge influence.

Second, among artists at their high point during the 80's, there is of course Prince (Purple Rain, Sign O' the Times) and Michael Jackson (Thriller, Bad), yet they were not mentioned.

Third, I agree that much 80's music sounds sterile because of the use of synthesizers, but that may have been in part because they were digital. By the beginning of the nineties, most musicians agreed that the old analog synthesizers sounded warmer, and the manufacturers in turn responded to that.

Best wishes, and please continue making great radio!

Roger

Sent by Rogier Landman | 10:24 PM ET | 09-04-2008

For me, the 80s had a huge musical moment: the birth of the CD. Hearing about Springsteen's CD-only box set made me buy a CD player a few months before and started me being a music collector instead of just drafting off my older brother's collection. So regardless of what music I was into, I was thinking about it differently. OK, OK: full disclosure, my first two CDs was a Vangelis import and Simple Minds.

Also: Stop Making Sense on film. HUGE.

Sent by Doug Thomas | 12:52 AM ET | 09-05-2008

I finally got to listen to the podcast of your show .... guys, thanks! I had a GREAT morning at work listening to you!!

Just wanted to put in my two pence worth ....

I'm 31 this year ... so I grew up in the 80s. I gotta say, my favorite type of music is 80s that's been remixed to techno ...

What I loved about the music of the 80s is that it's bouncy, fun loving, and MOVING!! There are a few songs that you wanted to slit your wrists to, but for the most part, you moved! Even now when you listen to alot of music for the 80s, you can't sit still! I'll play something real off the wall from the 80s here at work and everyone has an opinion, either it sucked and they remember what they were doing at the time, or tellin me to turn it up so they can relive a bit of their childhood.

Take Stairway to Heaven for instance.... people are either wanting to slit their wrists, or falling in love ..... not much in between. People galvanize about the music of the 80s. Everyone remembers the first video they saw ... or things like Soul Train. Falco was GREAT! briefly .... lol.

Wish I could hear more of you guyz, I can only get podcasts here at work!
ROCK ON!!

"Not all who wander are Lost..."

~Elden K. Aedui~

Sent by Elden K Aedui | 8:47 AM ET | 09-05-2008

Let's see..............I graduated High School in 81', graduated College in 86' and was Married in 89'. I'd say that puts many of my formative music years smack dab in your latest podcast. Although I found many of the comments LOL funny and I did find myself singing along in the car, I felt like I needed to take a shower when I got home. I drank a glass of JD and played an old John Lee Hooker tape that was in my garage.

It's amazing how much webspace is devoted to the 80's songs ( i.e., http://www.afn.org/~afn30091/80songs.html )

Thanks for not playing "It's Raining Men"......I would have driven off a bridge.


I always look forward to your shows and the live shows from the 9:30. My kids are sick of hearing the three song Wilco Sampler I play over and over.

Thanks,
Murph

Sent by Murph | 9:07 AM ET | 09-05-2008

I was in High School and 80's music forced me away from the mainstream music. It seems to me that was when the music industry really began to take (or regain) control over what we all heard.

I appreciated your inclusion of Tracy Chapman, but in a similar way, there was a little outside the box bubble of blues music. Robert Cray's Strong Persuader was huge for me... but also the Fabulous Thunderbirds & Stevie Ray Vaughan.

I don't think there has been another little genre bubble since. Maybe a few outside artists make it to the charts, but it seems the industry has had pretty thorough control since.

Good riddance... There's a reason why audience is slipping so bad...

Sent by Scott | 9:09 AM ET | 09-05-2008

Hey Bob,
>
> I just finished listening to the 80's show and the show before it.
> They were great. I especially liked the show examining how bad the
> 80's were. Personally, I thought they were fine but I found a lot of
> the same 'good' music your panel did. I kind of cringed with you on
> the Guns 'n' Roses track. I had never heard some of the tracks near
> the end of the show. Thanks for bringing great music to us each week.
>
> I listen to your show to find out what is happening in quality music
> but it's nice to look back now and then. You all did a great job in
> exploring the past. I would like to see more shows like this one.
>
> Your loyal listener,
>
> Tom Beckman

Sent by Tom Beckman | 10:25 AM ET | 09-05-2008

The show was definitely incomplete (as other posters have said) -- but sparked a few thoughts about why the 80s have a bad rap.

From the postwar birth of 'popular culture' as we know it up until the early '90s, the mainstream culture and the "counterculture" (or countercultures) existed in parallel. If you weren't seriously interested in music, you mostly got exposed to the former. If you were bitten by the bug and needed to seek out interesting, challenging, creative music with depth, you dove into the counterculture. There were some notable crossovers, of course, and you might say the Beatles jumped from the one thread to the other sometime in the middle of their career, but by and large much of what was popular was not very good and vice versa.

This continued pretty much up through the early '90s with the commercialization of "alternative" as a sound ("alternative is so mainstream" -- Jim's Big Ego) and then the rise of the Internet, which killed this structure once and for all.

When we think back to the '50s, '60s, and '70s, we don't think about the "mainstream / popular" music of the time, the products of the white-bread / sappy / novelty / brainless majority culture, since that stuff long since faded away. Instead we think about what was at that time part of the "counterculture" -- which was absorbed into mainstream culture as the decades went by.

But the '80s are too recent -- and we all remember them. And those of us who grew up then were exposed to the "brainless mainstream" culture up until we discovered that there was something else, something wonderful, lurking underneath. (For me that was '86.) So when we think of the 80s, the stupid stuff comes to mind first and crowds out the interesting music that continued to be made all through the decade.

That was what happened in your discussion, too. There were flickers of references to great things that were percolating (Bob, I can't believe you'd never heard The Bats before then!), but everybody's first reaction to "the 80s" was Starship and its ilk.

If you ask me, a decade which saw the rise of hip-hop, rap, sampling, home 4-track experimentation (think They Might Be Giants' first album) gave us more of the antecedents of our current culture than any other.

Sent by Mark Hessman | 11:54 AM ET | 09-05-2008

Boy, you guys nailed some bad ones there for sure. I also agree with most of the "good" 80s tunes that you played on the show.

However, I was a little disappointed with the way everyone on the show dismissed the synthesizer as simply "bad" and "cheesy". Granted, the synth was overused and abused in the 1980s. It's also important to note that the digital synthesizer was a brand-new instrument and, like the Moog of the 60s, was used for good AND evil, but was fresh at the time--sounds never heard before. I came of musical age in the 80s and at the time I wasn't really into the synth (or the drum machine for that matter), but I think you missed an opportunity to highlight some artists that were trailblazers with the synth sound or used it in creative or at least tasteful ways. Submitted for your approval (or not):

New Order
Thomas Dolby
ABC
Pet Shop Boys
OMD
XTC
Eurythmics
Michael Jackson/Quincy Jones (pre-"Bad")
Prince

Now, before I get flamed as an 80s-synth-apologist, I'd like to point out that I'm not a fan of all of the bands I listed above. Whether or not you like synth or the bands that used it, it should be acknowledged that these artists produced and pioneered sounds that have endured and/or inspired modern electronic, dance and pop music.

On a side note, I was in downtown Las Vegas a couple years ago and heard a band playing "We Built This City" on a stage set up on the street. I remember thinking, "Who in their right mind would cover that song?" When they finished the song--to mild applause--the lead singer called out, "Thank you! We're Starship! Good night!"

Sent by Greg Snyder | 12:35 PM ET | 09-05-2008

Dang... just was working through all the comments and Adrian near Seattle RickRolled us all. I feel dirty now.

Sent by Tim Letscher | 3:53 PM ET | 09-05-2008

Hey everyone,

What I found to be most offensive about 80's music, aside from the awful production quality, was the theater of it. I grew up in the mid- to late 1990's, when artists like Limp Bizkit, Kid Rock, Blink-182 and Eminem were enjoying the height of their popularity. At the time, I didn't really place the music I was listening to into any kind of broader cultural/historical context, due in large part to the fact that I was 12. But in hindsight, I feel that the music of my adolescence and the music of the 1980's have something very important in common, and that is a lack of authenticity.

I know that describing any music or art as "authentic" or "inauthentic" is kind of arbitrary and rather difficult to explain. But whenever I listen to 80's music, as well as the music that defined my early adolescence, I get this overwhelming feeling that I'm watching a play, albeit not a very a good one. In fact, it's probably more like an action movie. At any rate, it's as if the music I'm listening to isn't being performed by people, but rather by characters. And the lyrics and the themes that are expressed all seem as though they've been carefully selected to reinforce the image of the character, rather than the honesty of the artist. And this feeling of the music as inauthentic or plastic is only further emphasized by the indiscriminate use of synth sounds and gratuitous reverb.

I'm not saying that the artists of the era were being dishonest, or that the musicianship and songwriting was poor, only that their musical priorities were a little out of whack. It seems as though the primary goal was to polish the sound as much as possible, even to a point beyond recognition. That being said, I really wanted to thank you for including those songs by The Replacements, The Bats, & Minor Threat. I thought those were all fantastic. And I'm sorry Bob, but I gotta side with Robin, Stephen, and Carrie on this one, "Paradise City" is just pure rock n' roll brilliance. One of my favorite guilty pleasures. I laughed out loud when Robin demanded that you keep the song playing.

But on a serious note, I wanted to commend you all for including Guns N' Roses as a highlight of the 80's. I think it's easy to lump them together with the other, as Carrie so eloquently put it, "butt-rock" bands. But Gun's N' Roses always felt sincere to me. The songwriting was better, the guitar playing was better, and they rocked 10 times harder then any of their hair-metal counterparts. I know that GNR isn't exactly the usual fare for All Songs Considered, so I wanted to compliment you for including them and recognizing that it doesn't always have to be subtle and intimate for it to be good. Although, I do need to make a slight editorial comment. The music video to which Carrie referred, the one where Axl Rose is stepping off the bus, is not in fact the video for "Paradise City". The video to which she was referring is for "Welcome To The Jungle." Just wanted to point that out.

Sent by Jon | 5:29 PM ET | 09-05-2008

This discussion of 80's music was enjoyable. Obviously it was more light-hearted and fun, highlighting more of the excesses of the decade, but still taking time to point out some moments of genius. With practically any recent decade of music you could have either a serious debate or a fun discussion; making note of some of the more embarrassing moments or taking the time to find the really good musicians and songs. Perhaps now that the fun/novelty side of this discussion is out of the way, a latter, much-latter, serious debate might occur. I'm sure to the chagrin of many that the topic of 80's music could be stretched into a week long conference, but really... does anyone want that?

Sent by Matt Hocker | 9:27 PM ET | 09-05-2008

I finally got through the podcast today after listening to bits on my commute this week and felt compelled to to write in to mention a number of bands. However, most have already been mentioned above. (I graduated high school in '86, and college in '90, and listened to college radio throughout.)

I do think there was a lot of good unmentioned music in the 1980s, and some was even popular (e.g. 1980s Clash, U2, Gabriel (who was better than he was in the 1970s), Prince, Violent Femmes). There was even more that was relatively unknown, or less known, like the songs that are generally featured on the podcast. This is why I like listening to the All Songs podcast; I hear great music that I don't hear as much on commercial radio. So this episode was entertaining, but a bit of a break from the usual.

What was most surprising to me was that the hosts from my generation apparently and sadly spent the 1980s so trapped by the mainstream. If the point of the show was that there was dreck in the 1980s, there certainly was. But please don't feel compelled to do a show on the 1990s boy bands just to prove there was dreck in the 1990s as well. I'd rather listen to good music....

Sent by Charlie L | 9:54 PM ET | 09-05-2008

I could easily launch into a overly long and gaudy diatribe of the 1980s, but I'll spare anyone who actually browses through these comments here.

I loved this show, and I think retrospectives are an important part of music, so thank you ASC team for giving us a one-hour look back at the 1980s.

The one comment I won't reserve though is about the quality analysis: It was only briefly covered as to why the 1980s was a lack-luster decade for music (synthesizers, primarily), but we need to look beyond that and look to what we actually learned from the musical styles, what has lingered from that decade, and how some of those artists have tried to resurrect their careers in the present (I look to Rush and INXS as prime examples).

I will add one more thank-you here:

Thanks for not Rick-Rolling your audience.

Sent by Jeff Perkins | 9:58 PM ET | 09-05-2008

i just wanted to note something about bad 80s music. notice how many songs have a sharp loud over-reverbed snare hit at every 2nd and 4th beat. it is uncanny how common this is in the 80s. everybody needed that hammer of a snare, drilling the songs into our skulls.

i think dylan in the 80s is an interesting topic. imagine remixing songs from infidels & empire burlesque (and maybe even a couple from knocked out loaded or down in the groove), replacing the snappy snare-led drumming with more subtle percussion, and altering the reverb to give greater space and warmth. i believe you'd be left with the makings for an entirely improved listening experience. the songs suffered from the production - and this was a defining impact of 80s for a lot of "great" artists.

you asked - were there any artists who's body of work flourished in the 80s (compared to significant work in the previous decade)? In my opinion, I would say Tom Waits. He was great in the 70s, but he peaked with Swordfishtrombones and Raindogs (83/85). Also, John Hiatt - his 80s albums eclipsed his work in the 70s.

lastly - for me, the pixies and sonic youth were the saviours of creative rock in the 80s.

Sent by Ed | 4:09 AM ET | 09-06-2008

thanks for your 80s show! it was tremendously entertaining and enlightening! i love when you bring all those critics together. i always learn something new. please keep up the great programming.

Sent by ac | 7:45 AM ET | 09-06-2008

If people fall in love with music during their teen years how can today's
thirty somethings say they fell in love with music from the 60s or 70s when it wasn't part of their teen years? I am nostalgic for the music of the 80s so I was taken aback by the survey but when I looked at the sample of songs I realized that I am nostalgic only for the early electronic, post punk, British ska and new wave/punk music of the 80s some of which seems to have been resurrected(e.g. groups like Fischerspooner with the electroclash genre). So it seems to me that the discussion has to do with the Top 40 music of the 80s which was indeed bland but I really don't think the 70s were that much better with it's lack of glamour, and sentimental bland folk sensibility (e.g. Christopher Cross, Captain and Tennille's Muskrat Love).

Don DeBoer
Minneapolis, Minnesota.

Sent by Don DeBoer | 8:23 AM ET | 09-06-2008

Thanks for your segment today on 80s music. While I agree almost wholeheartedly, I would submit the following in commentary. Another band that did well leading the charge away from synthesizers and back to guitars was the Smithereens. A band that employed keys tastefully was Split Enz from Australia.
Thanks!

Sent by Scott Gaither | 10:41 AM ET | 09-06-2008

I just listened to your show about the music from the 1980's. Let me start by saying that I am not and never have been a fan of most Pop music. As your show began, you were covering mostly the popular radio songs from that era, which I agree was an incredibly bad time for that type of music. Although I guess it should be mentioned that the most successful Pop album of all time Michael Jackson's Thriller was released in 1982. At first I was rather disappointed that you were ignoring some great alternative music that did actually come from that time, but you did eventually cover some of it.

In my opinion the 1980's had some very great music come out of it. It was hard following the ground breaking music of the 1960's and 70's, but in my opinion the 80's brought us the last of any original music stylings. Maybe they were not truly original, but rather music that evolved out of what had preceded it, however, isn't that really what happened throughout the previous decades? For instance Industrial Music had began in the 70's with Throbbing Gristle, Boyd Rice and Cabaret Voltaire, but it became something completely different in the 1980's with bands such as Einsturzende Neabauten, Ministry, Coil, Test Department, The Swans, Crash Worship, the almighty Jim Thirwell aka Clint Ruin aka Foetus, Big Black, Skinny Puppy and even later in the decade with Nine Inch Nails. To say that what these bands brought to music was not original and great is like saying that Jimi Hendrix was just playing the blues.

Another great movement that really came of age in the 1980's was No Wave. Although it did not really evolve into a completely new entity but more or less continued with what was happening before the decade. Sonic Youth alone warrant credit with making the 1980's a great era.

Bauhaus and Siouxsie and the Banshees, yes I know they actually formed in the late 70's, but face it, they were really 80's bands when you look at when most of their great stuff came out. In fact Gothic Rock really was another fantastic movement that was born in the tail end of the 70's, but was more a child of the 80's. Bauhaus debut album "In the Flat Fields" was released in 1980 and the Gothic style would never look back. The Cure were making music in the 1970's but it wasn't until the 80's that they switched directions into more of a Gothic band. Thanks to these bands the record label 4AD was born which brought us the wonderful sounds of Cocteau Twins, Dead Can Dance, Throwing Muses, Dif Juz, Clan of Xymox, Wolfgang Press and This Immortal Coil.

OK, I know that I have a running theme here but to dismiss music that started in the tail end of the 70's only as 70's music, when it really kicked in and took off in the early part of the 1980's is not fair to the 80's. That being said let me move on to The Birthday Party. Nick Cave's early band sort of fit into a few music categories, but to me they are in a class of their own.

Other great bands from that era that deserve mentioning are the Violent Femmes, The Smiths, Stray Cats, The Pixies, Primus, Helmet, The Boredoms and REM (I know you mentioned them on your show, but I had to bring them up again because they are such an important band). Although they were not rock bands Fred Frith's Massacre and John Zorn's Naked City also warrant a mention for their simply over the top greatness!

One last thing that has to be talked about when discussing great musical things of the 1980's is the Brian Eno and David Byrne collaborative album "My Life in the Bush of Ghosts". In my opinion sounds and styles that were developed on this album have influenced more musicians in countless genres of music than any other single album.

The 1980's brought us some of the worst and some of the best in music. Although it was not my single favorite decade of music, if I had to pick my favorite 10 year period of music it would include a chunk of the 80's (1976 to 1985). I personally feel that music has steadily gone down hill since that era. Come on, how can you criticize the 80's without noticing how bad the music has been ever since?

Sent by Dan Colonna | 1:01 PM ET | 09-06-2008

I'm finished with this podcast. I'm not going to attempt to legitimize some opinion with shallow statements like "I'm no fan of pop music...", but I'm also not going to defend the music used in this episode. It's just not the point. Rather, when a show has to resort to exaggerated baloney like "oh god please!", "it's so painful to me", or forced laughter to fit in with criticism that's fashionable, then there's just no worthwhile content there anymore. It's like listening to the derrogatory chatter of an outcast group of children in high school. Acceptance over substance. I'm not in your club, and your music snobbery isn't endearing.

Sent by Don Fount | 3:30 PM ET | 09-06-2008

How can you guys even call yourself Gen Xers? Sure, we're glib, but arrogant? NOT.

Sent by www.GenerationXpert.com | 4:50 PM ET | 09-06-2008

Dear Editors,

You are such snobs! It's one thing to hear from a couple of guys who might actually have been in high school in the 80's, but give me a break when it comes to having a 33-year old comment on music that came out when she was not even ten years old! Did you forget bands like the Police, U2, and GnR? Much of the music of the decade might have been overproduced, but much wasn't--and you don't have to call yourself a college radio aficionado to have listened to and appreciate it. I've got another bone to pick with you on the subject of the '90s. I don't know what planet you have to be from to call the garbage I called complaint rock good music, but it wasn't. Grunge was horrible. The band members forgot how to actually play notes and decided that it was good enough to limit their musicianship to playing power chords. The lyrics and quality of the vocalists was horrible. That music was all about whining, complaining, and screaming (no melodies)--garbage!--and don't give me bands like Radio Head as great bands. Their music was garbage as well. You need to get your heads out of college and alternative radio snob city and remember why we listened to the music in the first place--we were sick of '70s and classic rock for one thing and wanted something that sounded new and different. (I'll admit; however, that you can throw out the teenie bopper crap that was written and played for 12 year olds.)

Sent by Gary Cosman | 8:03 PM ET | 09-06-2008

As someone who was born in the very late eighties in New Zealand this was an interesting show. I suppose a lot of what my idea of the eighties is shaped by my Mum's old tapes of music videos. But I have to say I'd kind of forgetten about most of the bad music because a lot of it generally just dies in the public conciousness. I've got a resonable amount of music from the eighties in my collection so I can say that an area that would have been nice to explore was some of the great British music happening at the time both in the mainstream and underground. Apart from the mention of NZ the show was very UScentric and could have benifited from some slices of The Smiths, New Order, Gary Numan and Young Marble Giants. Plus some Public Enemy and De La Soul would have been diverting.

Sent by Shaun D Wilson | 12:07 AM ET | 09-07-2008

As someone who was born in the very late eighties in New Zealand this was an interesting show. I suppose a lot of what my idea of the eighties is shaped by my Mum's old tapes of music videos. But I have to say I'd kind of forgetten about most of the bad music because a lot of it generally just dies in the public conciousness. I've got a resonable amount of music from the eighties in my collection so I can say that an area that would have been nice to explore was some of the great British music happening at the time both in the mainstream and underground. Apart from the mention of NZ the show was very UScentric and could have benifited from some slices of The Smiths, New Order, Gary Numan and Young Marble Giants. Plus some Public Enemy and De La Soul would have been diverting.

Sent by Shaun D Wilson | 12:07 AM ET | 09-07-2008

Let me begin by saying that the 80s show was great -- I podcast the show regularly and usually don't actually listen to it (the musical picks are not my thing most of the time), but this time I listened to the whole thing in-depth, and enjoyed the analysis.

A couple of things jumped out at me about the song choices, almost all reflective of the panel on the show --

1. The songs picked for review were overwhelmingly "white" -- almost no dance music, and only 2 black artists (no latinos), only one of whom would have had any real following from the African-American community (not Tracy Chapman). I assume this was largely a result of a totally white show panel (I can't say for sure, since I haven't seen any of your pix, but I'm assuming from voices, accent, and mentioned background), with no hispanics or African-Americans on the show to offer their choices. As a result, almost all of the songs picked did not have a dance beat or any significant R&B influence in them. This is a significant oversight, considering the 80s really continued the dance-heavy trend from the end of the 70s, including the golden age of gay club music (Pet Shop Boys, for example) and the natural path disco took. On the urban side, it also saw the golden age of rap, and the beginning of the silver age of rap as the first gangsta rap acts arrived. To ignore these for plain old bubble gum pop and semi-alternative riffs is to ignore the forest for the trees.

Most of the choices from the panel that they liked were either "Smiths"-type songs or accoustic, totally rejecting the new wave synth in its finer forms (such as "The Metro" or many songs from"Duran Duran"), and leaned heavily towards their acknowledged grunge tastes from the 90s. So basically, depressing, down-beat songs, just like Grunge songs were. In this way, the panel (of which I am 2 years younger than the youngest member on the panel) proved themselves true Gen X'ers, and also basically stuck to the same kind of
genres they usually covered on NPR.

2. Major omissions --

Michael Jackson. I mean, c'mon, how could you miss this? He was the "King of Pop" in the 80s because the quality of his work as a solo artist was so great, and he dominated the charts. He may have done good work with the Jackson 5 in the 70s, but he took the throne in the 80s, and is a clear example of a good artist who did the best in that decade compared to previous or subsequent decades. Once again, I wonder if this is due to a "white"-music bias by the panel, though Michael had a pretty broad appeal.

David Bowie -- While his "Let's Dance" album was criticized for being too commercial, it was just mainly a great artist doing a dance album (thus the title), and helped build interest so that many of us went back to his earlier works (though my mother always played his old stuff as well in the house when I was a child).

Huey Lewis and the News -- not sure where he falls, but he was an interesting phenomenon, worthy of discussion

Men at Work -- same as above

3. Song picks for the "cons" argument

A lot of the choices for the "80s were bad" argument were pretty unfair. I mean, of course Don Johnson is going to sing crappy songs, and if you don't like synthesizer, well yeah, it's going to make a lot of stuff sound bad, same as if you didn't like wailing guitars. The 70s and 90s for sure had their share of crappy songs too -- the argument should focus on the best, and then go accordingly into analysis. And yeah, I didn't really get the whole Hall and Oates thing either, most of their songs are like musical war crimes to my ears.

Understandably there was a lot of material to deal with -- I would love for you guys to do like 2 more shows on this topic (and other decades), as it was very interesting radio.