Following this story has made me sick. While I do not condone the practice of polygomy especially with young teen-age girls, taking over 400 children away from their mothers is wrong. I cannot believe this is happening in the United States of America. The trauma the children experience in this ordeal may be more harmful than what they experience in their home life. I can't see how taking these children, even infants away from mothers is "protecting the children".

Sent by Hayley Andrus | 1:12 PM ET | 04-18-2008

Isn't it ironic that this group wants to have it's own religious laws such as the allowing of multiple wives which is against the law and the rape (oh yea...marriage) of underage girls. But now that a member has decided they don't want to be treated this way, the group wants to use the law to get the kids back. I don't buy it. The men of the sect are cowardly to make the women handle all of this. Obviously they know that they have committed crimes against the state. I feel sad for the children, but I don't feel bad for the women who allow their daughters to enter into marriage and have sex and babies at age 13. I don't feel bad for any of them.

Sent by Sue Wargo | 1:17 PM ET | 04-18-2008

I agree that the women of YFZ are misguided & wrong - but does that mean the other small children should be taken away from their mothers? One angle that hasn't been explored (as far as I can tell) is that since Warren Jeffs has been incarcerated, it might be a good time for the state to attempt more positive interaction w/ the "compound". As a Texan I also believe that the state has mishandled this case in many ways. In the end I think more harm will be done than good.

Sent by elizabeth | 2:13 PM ET | 04-18-2008

I would point out that children are taken from low-income, often black, women every day to indifference or applause of the middle class public.

How is there a "religious" argument for rape of children? Why do we allow marriage at 16 but not 14? Because we're not going to ask judges or psychologists or physicians to judge each marriage application from a 9-year-old.

I can see much more significant risks of government/societal oppression of a minority religious practice with refusal of vaccination or the practice of circumcision than the warped perversion of pseudo-biblical patriarchy in this community.

Sent by Marc Naimark | 2:34 PM ET | 04-18-2008

It is NOT wrong to take children away from mother's who do not protect their children from abuse!!! What is the difference between a drug addict mother who neglects and abuses her child, or a child who is in the home with a father or step father who sexually abuses or beats and starves them? You would remove the child from that environment and rightly so. Well this is the same thing. Female children are being raped, yes raped, by much older men, and the male children are being groomed to continue this "tradition". This is just a cult that gives these sick men an "excuse" to sexually abuse young women and marry multiple women! These women are sick and brainwashed to subject their innocent children to this perverted cult. These innocent children deserve a real chance at life and they are not getting it living on that compound. I would never put my child in jeopardy and if anyone ever sexually abused one of my 2 girls..no matter what their age, let's just say that I would take the law into my own hands. Give these kids a chance at life and get these mother's some psychological help! And STOP talking as if this is some sort of RELIGION! It is a sex cult ,plain and simple...degrading women and raising young boys to do the same.

Sent by deanne Martin | 3:48 PM ET | 04-18-2008

If you want to know the inside story of the polygamous cult lead by Warren Jeffs (who live at the YFZ Ranch in TX and in Colorado City, AZ.), check out the recent documentary BANKING ON HEAVEN. http://www.bankingonheaven.com

Sent by pixel105 | 5:56 PM ET | 04-18-2008

What this issue touches on is, as the Pope talked about, the dictatorship of relativism. Relativism is the idea that everyone's morality is equally good, no matter what it is.

It's the whole "what's good for me is good for me; what's good for you is good for you." Well, we're seeing in this church's doctrine regarding marrying off girls to much older men that what's good for you not only isn't good for you, it's not good for anyone else either.

Now, to the question of the children, I don't relish the job of judge in this case. For those who say that many of the girls were abused, abuse that their mothers allowed to happen, they should be removed from that family. There are, however, going to be girls who weren't abused --there are 400 children, after all-- and their mothers have done nothing to harm them. That's why they deserve their day in court, a day that I'm glad I don't have to be part of.

Sent by Matthew Scallon | 6:09 PM ET | 04-18-2008

If the men have more than one wife, what happens to the men without wifes. Usually 50% of people are women and 50% are men. Why isn't there more competition for the women?

Sent by Tim Waldner | 8:19 PM ET | 04-18-2008

@ Tim Waldner - Teenage boys are regularly banished from FLDS communities ostensibly because of misbehavior. Most claim, though, that the real reason is to solve the problem of "surplus" men. There are hundreds of such kids living mostly in southern Utah. There's a New York Times article on the subject here.

Sent by Maura | 9:23 PM ET | 04-18-2008

While I seriously disagree with the theology and social customs of the FLDS, I am very concerned at the actions of the State of texas and the reaction of the majority of the American people. It's easy to judge against the FLDS and say Texas has done the right thing but there are possible harmful ramifications.

First, we need to keep in mind that these people may live in the 21st century but their mind-set is, for the most-part, 19th century agrarian society where when the men and women are old enough to procreate, they marry and do so.

Second, the Texas government has gone in and forcefully taken over 400 children based only on the idea they are indanger because they are being brainwashed. They want to take permanent control so the children can have a "normal" life. That means the state government is defining what is normal and whether or not the religious teachings are okay. This sets a horrible precdent -- who are they ging to go after next?

Third, the original call appears to have been false, but that did not stop them fom going in with high powered weapons , full body armor, etc. They then took all children without any cncrete evidence. Now, where there are girls who have been impregnated at a young age, I understand taking them and going after the fathers, but to take all children?

Finally, the ignorance displayed by government officials and media concerning the doctrines, social attitudes and structure of this society is sad. They shoul have experts with them other than ex-FLDS who have a grudge. There are plenty of scholars and experts on fundamentalism who could offer advice, etc.

Folks, we have a serious problem that is going to only get worse and where will it stop?

Sent by Craig L. Foster | 10:46 PM ET | 04-18-2008

Right on Craig L Foster! Points well worth noting!

Sent by Blaine Barrett | 8:08 PM ET | 04-19-2008

I feel sorry for the women and children in the compound. They are misguided, and the girls are taught from birth that they must serve men. This is an unsutiable environment for the kids. But they've already been brainwashed, so taking them could be harmful. Still, while we have freedom of religion, it must be within confines of the law. As another poster described it, their minds are in the 19th century but they really live in the 21st century, where it's unacceptable to brainwash young girls and force them to get married and have kids at 13 years old.

And by the way, kids are taken from their homes to foster parents every day. Why isn't there as big of a fuss for those kids? Plus, on the news reports I've seen where the mothers who want their children back talk, they sound a bit dazed, zoned out, hypnotized... Do all brainwashed people talk like that?

Sent by Sarah | 10:47 PM ET | 04-19-2008

I do not see Polygamy as the main issue: common law wives/husbands have always muddied the legal lines.

The rights under the law of children should be paramount. If there are cases of forced marriages - especially in linors - then removing the children from their parents is justified.

Whether or not they base their actions on belief, marriage and sexual conduct with minors is protected by law. I see that the judge had no other choice.

Sent by Gil Payson | 10:07 AM ET | 04-20-2008

What bothers me is the power that CPS has. They have the power to act on anonymous tips, and tear families apart.

Furthermore, there is nothing correct in thinking that the children "WILL BE BETTER OFF." 25% of Texas foster children are on heavy psychotropic medications. This is true in many states, and Congress investigated and it seems that often meds are used when counseling and adequate emotional support are not available.

Furthermore, foster children are at greater risk of abuse - physical, sexual, even MURDER than children raised by their biological parents.

Sometimes it is out of the frying pan and into the fire.

And where ARE parental rights in all of this? A Georgia state senator has called for JURY TRIAL when children are permamently taken from their parents. I think that is a very good idea. Otherwise, a poor parent goes into a courtroom and everyone's on state payroll. CPS makes money for every child they keep - they have no incentive to return children. Furthermore, siblings are often separated. I know my mom was neglected growing up, but at 15 she got married and left - she had a close relationship with her 8 brothers and sisters the rest of her life - and it was very supportive. All are things to consider.
That report is online.

Sent by Kris Gill | 6:12 PM ET | 04-20-2008

Right On Deanne Martin! You said it all as it is!!--and truly the facts! These women just allowed their children to be abused mentally, spiritually, and in some cases physically to the extent of breaking the laws here in the United States! Finally, someone who sees it as it truly is on one of these blogs--I totally agree and believe it to be the truth! I certainly hope these children will finally get the chance to live with their God given rights now...and not under some controlling religious leaders of a Devil's CULT!

Sent by parrottrader | 1:30 AM ET | 04-23-2008

I am not pro-polygamy. I am definitely against sexual contact with minors. I heard in the news that some of these mothers are under 18 years and will be placed in foster homes. Since they are under 18, I can see how the state feels the need to place them in foster care. I would like to ask if they will be reunited with their children? After all in the school that I work at, our teenage pregnancy rate is high and I do not see these teenagers loosing their children. I do not see the boyfriends going to jail for sexual relations with a minor. For all that anyone knows the sex could have been consentual.
Again, I do not approve of children having babies, but we should not be hypocrits when we impose justice.

Sent by D. M. | 10:28 PM ET | 04-24-2008

I was taken away from a parent when only 5. It was a good change. I've been thankful all my life for those who adopted, loved, respected, and protected my while teaching me proper values. Not all parents put the protection or proper raising of their children first. I will never stop being thankful my safety was considered important enough for someone to break "parental/child" bonds. The child's safety and well-being should far outweigh melodramatic, heart-string tugging sentimentality. Take it from one who comes from "the child's view".

Sent by Laura Williams | 12:07 AM ET | 04-25-2008

The State of Texas has overstepped its authority here. Due process has not been give to the children or to their parents. The children have been shipped off to far corners of Texas, which makes it even more difficult to keep track of the situation. In my opinion, the rights of these few have been grosely trampled upon.

Sent by Aaron Barr | 1:07 PM ET | 04-25-2008

the only thing the state of texas is doing is sending a loud and clear message to women and children everywhere:

god help you if you call the police, because the result will be the loss of your children and your life ruined with ridicule and shame and you sure as heck won't be helped.

this is just pure stupidity.

a man has sex with multiple women
one of those women (actually it's in doubt that she was one of those women)
calls in an anon. cry for help

is the man in jail?
is the woman being questioned?
heck no!
let's steal children away to god knows what kind of last ditch last minute care (because the state of tx could barely find temp foster care before being dumped with 400 in one shot) and leave the women wishing they'd taken a beating from the men than the emotional trauma of a beating from the state - because they'd at least be able to take care of their kids.

I'm not for abuse. I'm not for minors being coersed into sleeping with some old guy and calling it marriage.

But the truth is: if these same men had just been shacking up with some groupie set of hoochie baby mamas there wouldn't have been a word said, much less legal action to remove the kids.

do we take children away from hookers and unwed young mothers and require dna tests? not saying these are women of ill repute, but my point is the same. a man fathering a bunch of kids and women being willing to have those kids isn't usually grounds to remove children - gangs, hookers, unfaithful marriages have the same result.

why are these children and women being broken down like this in a scenario where zero abuse has been proven for any of them? If there was a case of abuse or rape of a minor (forced marital acts is rape whether the marriage is recognized or not!) - why didn't they gather evidence and due process for that specific crime?

If the men are accused of polygamy, then why aren't the MEN in custody?

No that'd make way too much sense.
Let's take the children and send a clear message to the women (who have to continue dealing with those supposedly abusive men in the mean time) that they'd better never make a call for help again.

STUPID!
CRUEL!
SHAMEFUL!
WRONG!

Sent by Martha | 5:25 PM ET | 04-25-2008

There are children living in families everywhere in the United States which we nicely call blended families. It is very common for women to have children who have different fathers and is becoming more common not less. The thing is they don't necessarily legalize and marry. So men who have several children by different women do not have multiple wives because they don't legalize the union. They often just live together. Thank goodness we are not putting all of these families in jail. Also, it has come down through our history that teens under the age of 18 have had babies. This is nothing new. My graduating class in high school had 105 of our girls get pregnant, the first one was 15 as I recall. It bothers me now that the over 18 boyfriend is put in jail for having sex with his girlfriend who is under age 18. There have been attempts to educate our kids to abstinence of sex until they are 18 but I hear of more young girls being put on birth control instead. It bothers me that all of these children in Texas were taken away in a raid on their home. It is not the home I would have chosen but I feel they have the right to live in peace. By the way, this country has done this type of thing before with our native american populations. It was called the Indian Relocation Act where children were taken from their mothers off the reservation and placed into a "better" society. Many native Americans have come home as adults and have found their family or origin and reunited.

Sent by ekay | 10:14 PM ET | 04-25-2008

I am so glad to see the outrage of the people on this issue. I just hope someone with some pull will hear us before too much damage is done to those children.

I am particularly moved by Martha's comments. I was saddened and frightened for the children who were torn away to God knows what kind of care. The trauma this kind of separation will create is unspeakable. If all of these kids could fall into loving, kind, nurturing hands perhaps it wouldn't be as traumatic, but we all know that just isn't the case...that 400 children dropped into the foster care system will find that...in any state! But I think Martha raises an excellent point...all this teaches us is - God forbid if you ask for help! If you are abused keep your mouth shut or your children will literally be ripped from your arms!

I am a teacher who has worked with children who have been in the foster care system and teen parents. Some of the best mother's I have seen have been teen parents, who were in abusive situations and got themselves out...with the help of social service agencies. It is also true that the children that I know who were in the foster care system often were abused or neglected by their foster families or simply shuffled from one family to the next. In the state of Maine, I believe it is the law to investigate and work with a family to create a safe environment before taking children away. What is the law and practice in Texas? Were 400 children in immediate danger? And what of the men, if they are the rapists why are they free to roam the streets? What about all of this DNA testing? Are they really going to unite these children with these fathers who are sleeping with underage women? Why is that seen as a first priority? This whole thing is pretty convoluted.

Sent by Eva Wagner | 11:11 PM ET | 04-25-2008

It sounds like Nazi Germany to me. CPS even took away the mothers cell phones and all children over the age of one. I have a nursing baby that is only seventeen months old. No freedom left here. I find it impossible to believe that all the children or even a majority are in any harm by staying with the mothers that have raised them thus far. Statistically I believe that foster children receive 1000 times worse treatment than any of the children CPS is supposedly saving.

Sent by Katie | 12:01 AM ET | 04-26-2008

polygamy exist in every religion they may no longer practice it but that does not mean it goes away there are also reasons for taking a second wife that have nothing to do with a mans whims. 2nd marriages are approved for reasons such as having children in the 1st wife is unable. or if the 1st wife has become seriously ill and can no longer be sexually involved with her husband most religions also say that a girl is legal to marry when she has her 1st menstral cycle. so how much wrong has really been done here. how many girls did not want their marriage and how many did. i believe if the girl was forced into the marriage then she should be protected from any further harm because it was rape. but if the girl entered their marriage willingly then that marriage is right and just regardless of her age at least she did marry before becoming sexually active and having children it is far better then a lot of teenage girls becoming mothers and having no idea who the father is. yet because the girl was willing no legal action is taken. well if these girls were willing then no legal action should be taken against them their mothers or their husbands. if comes by rape including a girl unwillingly forced into marriage it should be severly punished. but do not condeme the entire idea of polygamy if someone choses to practice it properly then their is no sin on them nor should they face public abuse simply because most of them do not.

Sent by misty | 1:41 PM ET | 04-26-2008

Can anything by done to help these children and mothers to stay together?
Protest by the court house, signing a petition, or something like that?
Any body knows?

Sent by Valentina | 2:39 PM ET | 04-26-2008

Wouldn'tit have been more appropriate to take the alleged perpetrators into custody rather than the women and children? After all, if the allegations are true, these men are pedophiles.

Further, where are the men from this sect? Why are they not speaking out publicly and offering themselves up to the state officials to protect their wives and children?

Sent by terri | 12:50 PM ET | 04-28-2008

I am sickened by the repeated use of the word abuse in this case. The government is the only abuser here. All peasant societies have allowed and encouraged early marriage and this was the case in America before it became an urban-industrial country. My grandmother marry my grandfather when she was fourteen and they had 12 children and were a model of a family. Was she abused or raped? NO The only person who has the right to define abuse is the victim of abuse and nobody has yet done so in this case.
Rape is the use of force to make someone surrender an intimate part held sacred. The government has raped these women by forcing them to surrender what they hold most sacred: their children.

Sent by Jose Caraballo | 9:24 AM ET | 05-12-2008

The people of this sect knew they were breaking the law to begin with. Polygamy is and has always been illegal in the USA. They should have thought about the possible consequences of their actions before persisting in these practices.
And yes - it is ALWAYS the children who pay when adults make poor decisions invoving them. The state has the responsibility as well as the right to step in and investigate on behalf of the children who need an advocate.

Sent by Susan | 4:28 PM ET | 05-20-2008

One of the oldest verses in the bible is that you reap what you sew and what these men and women have sewn into this community is filth, evil, lust and sin. It is good that they have taken the children out and I hope that it eventually comes to the point that they put them up for adoption and take parental rights away from all of the mothers. Those women will do nothing more than raise those children to be future brides or rapist. A mother's first and foremost responsibility is to protect her child from any and all harm and these mother's weren't but instead they were offering up their children to be married, raped or both. Their sons they were either sending away or teaching to be rapist themselves. This is not a fit mother and should not be given their child back or felt any sympathy for because her child has been taken away from her. This is not a mother but a subject who idolized a leader. You can call it brainwashing but it is still idolitry which is a sin. As far as the men of the compound, they should all be given a lie detector test and I am sure you will find out that they are all guilty of rape of a minor and then you can incarcerate all of them like they should be. Once the men are incarcerated, the children are being adopted into good and loving families, the women can just find a life for themselves elsewhere hopefully sooner and not later. With a public announcement that the children were eligable for adoption they would be adopted within weeks. People have compassionate hearts and love to help those who truly need it. The mothers knew what they were doing, the children are innocent.

Sent by T. L. Carrin | 10:42 AM ET | 06-13-2008