NPR: Is Vietnam the Right Comparison for Iraq?

Is Vietnam the Right Comparison for Iraq?

President Bush took a big chance Wednesday and drew comparisons between the situation in Iraq and the situations that the United States has faced over the years in Asia, such as in Japan in World War II and in Korea and Vietnam.

But are those appropriate analogies? All Things Considered talked to four scholars to find out.

Francis Fukuyama of the School of International Studies at Johns Hopkins University says the analogy to Southeast Asia is more appropriate than the president's previous use of the Cold War. Max Boot of the Council on Foreign Relations favors comparisons to conflicts in Algeria and Malaysia. In Malaysia, the British were able to overcome an insurrection. In Algeria, the French won militarily but ultimately lost politically.

Ronald Steel of the University of Southern California thinks the U.S. involvement in the Philippines at the turn of the 20th century is the best example — an analogy I've always favored as well. The United States overthrew a then-dictatorial power, Spain, but failed to recognize that there was a strong liberation movement among the people, who wanted the U.S. to let them run their own country. When the U.S. didn't leave, a long period of violent insurgency followed, during which U.S. troops committed several atrocities.

Then again, Joseph Nye at Harvard doesn't like any analogy, although he says Vietnam may be appropriate or perhaps Britain's role in Iraq in 1920s. But in the end, he believes, all analogies fall apart on some level.

Maybe it's like the old Shiite saying that host Robert Siegel quotes: "The first to reason by analogy was the devil."

9:41 AM ET | 08-23-2007 | permalink

Comments

If the world aka the United Nations had the will, they could stop all genocide.The problem is that self interest aka selfishness precludes that from happening.

Sent by Ken Rickson | 12:26 PM ET | 08-23-2007

First off, many an American of military age today couldn't find Vietnam on a map. In school, they hated history. Ergo, you can't compare Iraq to Vietnam because most just don't know what Vietnam was. And second, most don't care. If there was no gasoline at the pump, then they'd get a little worried. Other than that, no comparison is expected to be made on any discerning national poll between Iraq and Vietnam...or the movie '300,' for that matter. fred call aka bigbro

Sent by fred call | 10:19 AM ET | 08-24-2007

Perhaps the best historical analogy for Iraq is not the Vietnam War, but the Phillipine-American War(s) of 1899-1913. The Unites States easily took the Phillipines during the Spanish-American War in 1898, but then needed to send well over 100,000 troops to the Phillipines for the resulting occupation and insurrection.

The first time the U.S. Army encountered muslim suicide-warriors was not in Iraq, but during the Moro Rebellion in the Phillipines. The U.S. Army 0.45-caliber pistol (M1911), was first developed and used against the Moros.

Sent by Randy Porter | 12:03 PM ET | 08-24-2007

First of all, just because one believes that young adults today can't find Vietnam on the map, it doesn't follow that somehow there is no relevant connection today.

They both were started with lies. The Gulf of Tonkin incident never happened. Johnson anticipated it due to something that happened the day before I believe. I don't know all the details of that incident. I do know that Johnson had his address ready before the supposed Gulf of Tonkin incident even occured. Something did happen that day, but much less than was expected. Communication lines got crossed and Johnson went ahead with his address. Later (supposedly) he learned what a lot of others knew all along, yet didn't retract his words. This is somewhat similar to the "selective intelligence" that started the Iraq war. Also, now we again have a president who refuses to admit his mistakes. Since when is the truth bad politics?

Sent by Matt | 12:55 AM ET | 08-26-2007

I think your correct and I would like to add that although no two things are alike there can still be some similarities. I just saw this documentary, Sir! No Sir! Which is about the G.I. movement during Vietnam and how they made underground newspapers about what was really going on. It reminded me of the soldiers in Iraq blogging about their experiences. Here???s their website.

http://www.sirnosir.com

Sent by Caleb Cambee | 7:40 PM ET | 12-13-2007

Sent by Caleb Cambee: I just saw this documentary, Sir! No Sir! Which is about the G.I. movement during Vietnam and how they made underground newspapers about what was really going on.

Caleb, congratulations, my friend. Some in-depth commentary with journalistic qualities.

Thank you. And if I can add a suggestion, if you haven't seen the documentary 'Fog of War' with former Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara, I suggest you do so. And if you do, I'd enjoy hearing your thoughts.

Sent by Matt: They both were started with lies. The Gulf of Tonkin incident never happened.

Well, Matt. Something happened out there. And Lyndon Johnson later commented that for all he knew, the U.S. Navy was shooting at whales out there.

Yes, the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution was congress's way of authorizing Johnson to expand his war in Vietnam. Some would say that the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution is equivalent to the '9/11' conspiracy theories. Some would even go further to say, as Oliver Stone said in his movie 'JFK,' that the JFK assassination happened because Kennedy was ready to take Eisenhower's advice to pull out the American advisors from Vietnam.

Gulf of Tonkin, JFK assassination and '9/11' all come under the heading of conspirarcy theory. You have your Warren Report. You have congress's overwhelming support of the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution. And you have reams of investigations into '9'11.'

What is conspiracy theory from what is journalistic reporting is a big topic, has been a big topic and obviously will continue to be a big topic.

Just as there are hundreds of conspiracy theory surrounding the Lincoln assassination.

Conspiracy theory and balanced journalism somehow have to find a common ground. Because the American public tends to grow weary of conspiracy theory without any form of foundation. Conspiracy theory is sometimes viewed by the public as the dumb person's journalism.

If you have a conspiracy theory you believe worthy of further investigation, you have to go looking for evidence to support your assumption.

Hate to be making this blog sound like a Journalism 101 class, but there are too many bloggers in this blog who do not know anything about the basic disciplines of journalism.

Hence, this blog has been turned into gossip by a handful of bloggers.

Probably the average NPR blogger is more intelligent than all that.

fred call
fred call

Sent by fred call | 10:58 AM ET | 12-14-2007

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