July 23, 2007
If you're the CEO of a major corporation, there's one sight you probably don't ever want to see: Michael Moore and a film crew, knocking at your front door. He's taken auto makers, the gun industry, and even the President to task, and now he's gone after the industry that probably affects the most of us most acutely: healthcare. I know you've got questions for him... leave them here.
Is it possible for employers to bear any more responsibility for health care costs than they already do? I am in favor of health care reform, but I wonder if we'll ever create change when there is such resistance to paying more in taxes to fund those reforms.
Bravo Mr Moore' Saw Sicko this weekend and thought it was excellent. I am a nurse and teach medical terminology at a community college and would like to show it to my classes. When will it be available on DVD? Please keep up your good works.
If I had been disgnosed with stage 3 breast cancer in Britain in 2002 instead of here in the States, my treatment would have been only Arimidex (a breast cancer fighting medication I now have been on since Aug 2002). No mastectectomy, or lymph node removal, chemo, radiation as I had through my employer based insurance. I do think our health insurance system is flawed but please don't hold up other country's systems as perfect.
Mr. Moore, I applaud your courage to do what very few have done! I am one of those Canadian citizens living in the US. I never worried about medical insurance when I lived in Canada but now, I worry a lot about losing medical insurance if I ever lose my job! It's like we are working just to not lose medical coverage! Even if the Canadian system is not perfect, atleast it's egalitarian! Hats off to you and your documentary.
Hello, I am a French living the the silicon valley, I want to confirm to all listeners, what was said about the French social security system in Sicko is totally true.
If you include free edication and free health care, French are less taxes than the average american.
Thanks To Mr Moore for trying to open the eyes of US citizens
Hi Michael Morre, and thanks for a much needed commentary on the American health care system. My husband and I attended a showing in Canton, MI a few weeks ago. Most of the audience, for that matinee, were elderly people, some in wheelchairs and walkers. There were a number of elderly men wheo were quite crotchety and loud, who made disparaging comments throughout the movie, loudly voicing their oppopsition to you point of view. Then, around the middle of the film, as you systematically addressed every issue that they were loudly bringing up, the theatre fell silent-except for the occassional sobbing. At the end, as the lights went up, the most vocal elderly gentleman loudly made his final comment "Everyone in America needs to see this movie!" You won him over, Michael, and he was one cranky old conservative guy. But I agreed with his final comment, everyone needs to see this movie. Thanks for everything, and God bless you. You are the voice of America's conscience.
I have one question for mr. Moore. What about all deaths that go unreported because counties like England, Canada, Cuba do not offer adequate care to all those who need it in a timely fasion. I have information on many who were not able to receive medical care quicly enough and either came to the U.S. or died.
I do not consider your so called documentaries to be the other side. I see them as another lie, simply from a different perspective. How do you respond to that? What numbers and statistics to counter your claimes?
Changing US healthcare seems to be as difficult as stopping global warming. The film is a great first step, but what REALLY can we do? What are the first steps?
Here are some ideas:
One State leads the way.
I have not seen Sicko, but as an employee of a major pharmaceutical, I'll be extremely interested in the movie. My question is that even when "bringing balance" opposite the American media, I wonder if it's possible to present the material that's not so obviously extreme as to more convince people of the issues, rather than polarize people who've previously made up their minds. But I do thank you for your movies.
I trained at a Minnesota medical facility. We regulary had Canadians come to us for health care because their "clinic" ran out of money and closed until the next fiscal year. You did not address this nor lawsuits over waiting "lists."
Mr. Moore,
You starred in a movie opposite Vanessa Redgrave called The Fever. Can you comment on the relationship between this exploration of capitalism and the issues raised in Sicko? And why has this movie not seen more coverage?
I work full time so that I can have health insurance, and I don't have children.
If I did have children, I'd work extra hard and do whatever necessary to get a job that offers health insurance.
I'm not so keen on the fact of working full time for insurance; today for example, I'd rather be at the beach reading a book and drinking beer.
I probably would be at the beach, if I knew that some tax-payer were paying for my heatlh insurance. Why buy the cow, when you can get the milk for free?
My wife is an anesthesiologist who is sickened by the health care system. She and other concerned physicians believe that nationalized medicine would take away the greed from the system. It would also take away the greedy individuals who are in it just for the money. Nationalized health care would allow the real physicians who care to be in charge and the money chasers would find a new line of work. By the way, the primary conflict fellow doctors she works with bicker over is MONEY
Pls tell us why other countries can afford to subsidize their health care but US companies/govt can't afford to! On top of the universal health care in canada, many large companies provide private insurance as a benefit to their employees and don't cry about it the way US companies do. So I don't understand why the big, rich companies in the US make such a big deal? Is it pure greed?
I think I know some of the answers. To nationalize health care, which we "should" do, insurance companies will loose much money and power; some physicians will loose much money because there will be some system for limiting care to what is reasonable; trial lawyers don't want tort reform which will be needed; medicine is a cottage industry in the USA and is just too damned independent to be told what to do. It's all about the money and political power. Oh, by the way, the social democracies in Europe have higher taxes - we'll need that, too.
Bravo!! Ten fold aplauses for Mr Moore-- keep up your anger level and take more on this administration, wimp media and these powerful interest groups you're taking on right now. Democrats are just talking, and debating without any teeth. The media is just too polite and afraid to not loose it's $$$ and sponsorship, just softly to not hurt anybody asking accountability from this administartion. Please iimagine your next subject: this country becoming a "banana Republic" under Bush and Cheney with their long-long corruption list--Thank you!
Mitch
Mr. Moore
The Iraq war removes health care issues and the general assult on working people in this country from the amount of public debate and scrutiny these issues deserve.
Please comment on this statement
Michael Moore,
I would like to share my experience as a cancer survivor stranded in Europe because of treatment for cancer here which has left me uninsurable in the US.
Michael Moore briefly touched upon this topic in "Sicko," and I'm interested in hearing more of his thoughts on this: what are the implications of having almost an entire generation of young people saddled with educational debt? I'll owe more than $40K when I finish my master's, and it's making me feel hopeless about my future.
What does Michael feel about Democratic Party's efforts for an "affordable" health care system vs the free systems in Canada and Europe? Afre these "affordable" systems proposed by the Democrats likely to do away with HMO system and control of system by large pharmaceuticals? His opinion on this would be very interesting.
Race & the History of Socialized Health Care
I believe part of the resistance to publicly funded healthcare historically has been colored by racist as well as class contempt, i.e., the unwillingness to help poor blacks (and browns).
FDR had to re-write his original plans for Social Security to remove benefits from agricultural and domestic workers (who, for the most part in the 1930s, were poor black workers) to get the legislation approved by white Southern Democratic Congressmen. These racist effects on gov't services still echo today.
Public health services are for "them" -- poor black and brown people; while private care is probided to the relatively privileged (white) "middle-class."
I want to see Moore's film "Sicko" and I hope the racist effects are explored in it as well as class.
Michael Moore's altruistic statement to the effect that "no American should have to be denied a life saving operation or mediaction: [ because of its cost ] ignores reality. Operations and mediacations cost money, often lots of money. Someone must pay for those costs. In my view, important questions to be asked are "how much medical expenses can the Nation afford" and the corrollary questions, "to what extent should we increase taxes to pay for universal medial care, or is it appropriate to cut back on other publicly financed programs such as the military, education, farm subsidies, low cost loans for college, etc."?
It is my suspicion if the same level of medical care were extended to all of our population as is provided to those who now are covered by both Medicare and god private insurance that we as a Nation could not afford such costs no matter what the source of payments.
I would like the dialog with Michael Moore continued or at least covered by another Talk of the Nation program.
Pharmaceutical companies are in control because we've avoided natural medicine ever since natural healers were massacred during the "witch hunts" in Europe several generations ago. Pharmaceuticals are often natural herbs whose molecular structure has been tweaked so it can be patented for profit. This introduces unnatural alterations into the body in an age when abberrations result in cancer and kill people. Natural medicine is inexpensive because its herbs and procedures aren't patented. It can take longer to heal the problem from the root, but this avoids the high cost of putting people on drugs for life. Drugs always overtake the body's ability to produce its own chemicals, so they always lead to atrophy and decay of bodily systems. Instead, natural medicine nurtures the body, like a garden, so it grows and heals. This creates an environment where problems don't grow, avoiding the need for costly surgeries and extreme treatments for cancer.
The bottom line should always be considered when treating people. The resources used to heal people come from social resources that could also be used for a variety of programs that benefit people. Out of concern for the social welfare, all people should take it upon themselves to stay healthy and avoid risky activities like some sports. Natural medicine helps people feel how food and activities affect them more powerfully, so it naturally helps maintain health. We should all learn more about natural medicine and support its inexpensive but effective means of maintaining health for the person and society over the long-term.
Michael Moore wonders where this mentality comes from-its Protestantism. By the way its only the Judeo-Christian ethic which teaches helping all in need. Also, some people refuse help even from the government. My own brother refuses government help and lives in a delapidated, messy apartment in the ghetto. Government red tape is worse than business red tape! From national health care deliver us! I've experienced it in Germany. It is run just like our HMO. They encourage people to abort babies and sick or old people to die. Competence of physicians is not any better than here. Here the only thing doctors want to do is give immunizations. Tests are avoided like the plague since they cost money.
I avoid going to the doctor for anything other than the most obvious need.
On "Fresh Air," on July 9, Johnathan Oberlander mentioned that one of the reasons that American health care costs so much is that huge amounts of money are spent on the bureaucracy of insurance. If less time and money were spent trying to decide what would be covered--by saying, "We'll cover everything for everybody"--the increased medical expense would be at least partially offset.
The phrase, "what will it take for you to give up your bottle water?" is really the wrong question.
I need to say that I have been using Nalgene bottles and have carried my own water wherever I go for years, this should not be a new idea. However, there are times that I may run out while I am traveling. Then I will buy the water. I will also take the empty bottle to my destination and recycle it, or reuse it.
So the prudent question would be, "what will it take for you to recycle your empty bottles and use less bottled water?"
I am glad this concept has become such a hot button that it made it to this program. The problem is that we will need to change the way of thinking for many people who will not drink tap water and see bottle water as healthier than tap water rather than a convenience. It will take a long time to swing the pendulum back.
Massachusetts' health insurance law is worse than the caller suggested in that it is more punitive than just taking away a tax credit. Actually it takes away your $220 personal exemption in its first punitive year 2008.
In years that follow if the affluent and privileged folks on the Insurance Connector Board deem that you can afford to buy private insurance and you refuse they sicc the MA Department of Revenue on you which fines you 50% of the minimum premium they determine you can afford. This could easily be an extra couple of thousand dollars per year for a taxpayer with less than a $2000 per year current state tax obligation.
Thus an honest taxpayer working two jobs or self employed but with no health insurance could easily find himself owing the state double his tax rate.
Meanwhile his state employee neighbor gets his Cadillac health insurance paid for with pre-tax dollars.
And if you're a Massachusetts tax cheat the Chairman of the Insurance Connector Board has good news for you. During the WBUR show ???Your Call??? with Bob Oakes John Kingsdale is heard counseling an admitted tax evader on his options for getting cheap health insurance. Slide the player???s time to 43:40 and prepare to get sick if you???re an honest taxpayer.
http://www.wbur.org/news/2007/66925_20070504.asp
Moore is absolutely correct when he says he balances out a sicophant news media including NPR that loves to headline the 45 million uninsured Americans but has no stomach for real health care reform. One need only look at their fawning praise for Massachusetts' "model for the nation" punative insurance law.
Massachusetts law was written to favor deep pocketed health care lobbyists like Blue Cross Blue/Shield and Partners Health Care after Massachusetts got in trouble with the federal government for spending too much on free health care and had too pass eleventh hour panic legislation.
Massachusetts plan is just bad. Avoid it like a dead skunk on the road on hot and humid summer day.
Leeta wrote:
By the way its only the Judeo-Christian ethic which teaches helping all in need.
That's not really the case. One of the five pillars of Islam is zakat, which requires that Muslims give alms to the poor and needy. Tradition also encourages voluntary giving, or sadaqah, on top of the required zakat. This word shares the same ancient root with the Hebrew word for Jewish charity, tzedakah.
To Irene C: I hope Santa and the tooth fairy are good to you. I assume you belive in them as well.
Dear Rick: I have tried both Western and Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) for the same problem. This is how I realized first-hand how well natural medicine worked. Have you tried natural medicine? If you are knocking it before you try it, then who believes without proof?
I do think many practicioners of natural medicine are not trained well enough. My doctor used to be the head of TCM at a hospital in China. I hear traditional Chinese doctors were trained for years as they grew up, unlike modern American 4-year programs that train people who may mean well but are still recovering from the Summer of Love. When cultural traditions have developed over thousands of years, we might consider there could be some collected wisdom there rather than scorning them outright.
Do you not believe the witch hunts occurred? Do you see the parallels between how witches are portrayed with practicioners of natural medicine? Our culture has instilled in us an aversion toward natural medicine because for several generations people who revered nature were murdered. Now, in the aftermath of that, our planet is dying from the unnatural things we have done to it. It's not the tooth fairy that reported this to me. Through pollution, these things are now killing us -- sometimes people close to us. This is why I advocate a different way that I have found to work. Of course, I was also open to natural medicine, which involves the mind.
Skip Claypool wrote:
"I have one question for mr. Moore. What about all deaths that go unreported because counties like England, Canada, Cuba do not offer adequate care to all those who need it in a timely fasion."
I have a question for Skip Claypool. How is someone dying waiting for treatment in a universal treatment system worse than someone dying for lack of treatment period. Health care in the U.S. is rationed by lack of insurance, under- insurance and insurance decisions.
Also, you can toss around any anecdotes you wish but one need only look at the demographic data CIA Factbook or the WHO data to know that Cuba effectively ties the U.S. in life expectancy and infant mortality. Canada and England beat us while spending less per capita on health care.
When asked why other points of view were not presented in his movie, Michael Moore responded by saying he did not see the need their views have been reported by the media. Well, I do not recall the last time health insurance and pharmaceutical companies were engaged in substantive interviews by the media about the high cost of health care. NRP did not ask Moore to clarify.
In the movie, a physician who used to work for an HMO confessed that she denied care because the procedure would have cost $0.5 million dollars, i.e. HMO would have to pay out that amount to the providers. The question that came to mind is that why is our healthcare so expensive?
It is easy to demonize HMOs and pharmaceutical companies. However, the roles of other important players/factors in the delivery of health services need to be examined carefully: hospitals, physicians, other health care providers and unions representing them, courts, oversupply of hospital beds, providers and equipment, etc.
While we all recognize the way we currently finance our health care is not sustainable long term and that universal healthcare in some form or shape is probably inevitable in the future (sooner better than later), the biased picture of the problems facing our health care system as presented by Moore is misleading to the uninformed.
No universal healthcare system provides coverage for ALL health services. They typically do not cover procedures or treatments considered experimental, same as HMOs. In the Canadian system, patients either pay out-of-pocket for non-covered services or they fight the provincial ministry of health system by taking it to court or to arbitration.
Actually, natural medicine is already accepted in conventional medical centers. My city's main hospital uses acupuncture in the cancer ward. It is also used in treatment programs to help drug addicts recover. Reflexology is taught to patients in mental hospitals. Results of studies that demonstrate the benefits of meditation appear in the popular media. Many people who practice yoga can attest to its benefits for physical and mental well-being. Good diet and exercise are also forms of natural medicine. Some insurance companies cover natural therapies like acupuncture. All these remedies are inexpensive compared to pharmaceuticals and surgery, so they ease our country's health care burden.
As a Canadian who spent 12 years living in California before moving here to France I can tell you that my experience with all three systems support everything this film is saying. Furthermore, the U.S. is viewed by the French people as completely crazy when it comes to the health care system. Socialized medicine really does work!
I'm concerned that the debate on universal health care seems to be ignoring ethics. True, financial considerations all always there, but we must ask ourselves, as a nation, if it is moral and ethical to deny this particular right (universal access to some form of health-care system.) If we decide on the ethical framework first, then we can figure out what energy and resources we want to allocate. This should be first an issue of ethics.
I am from Spain and have lived there for 39 years. I have also lived in the US for 5 years. I have used both systems and I have seen that both have flaws and none is perfect. However, this whole controversy reminds me of a quote by, I believe, Germaine Stein, "I have been rich and I have been poor. Believe me, rich is better."
Believe me, American citizens are being deceived.
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