Shop Guys Talk McCain, Alleged ICE Cover-up

Copyright © 2009 National Public Radio®. For personal, noncommercial use only. See Terms of Use. For other uses, prior permission required.

MICHEL MARTIN, host:

I'm Michel Martin, and this is Tell Me More from NPR news. Just ahead, comments from you on our blog. Backtalk is next. But first, it's time for our weekly visit to the barbershop, where the guys talk about what's in the news and what's on their minds, sitting in the chairs for a shapeup. This week, our freelance writer Jimi Izrael, civil rights attorney and editor Arsalan Iftikhar, media executive Nick Charles, and syndicated columnist Ruben Navarrette. I may jump in once or twice, but for now, take it away, Jimi.

Mr. JIMI IZRAEL (NPR Freelance Writer): Hey. Thanks, Michel. Fellows, hey. What's up? And welcome to the shop. How's everybody doing?

Mr. ARSALAN IFTIKHAR (Civil Rights Attorney and Editor): Hey.

Mr. NICK CHARLES (Media Executive): Hey, doing good.

Mr. RUBEN NAVARRETTE (Daily Herald Columnist): Hey, Jimi.

Mr. IZRAEL: Well you know what? Strangely enough, ICE is back in the news now. Last year they landed in hot water after a white employee showed up at the Halloween party hosted by top ICE officials, dressed in a striped prisoner outfit, dreadlocks, and darkened skin makeup. We talked about that a bit. And, Michel, we got some tape on that, right?

MARTIN: Yeah, you guys did talk about. George Kelly, one of our Shop regulars, and he was talking about it.

Mr. IZRAEL: Right.

MARTIN: Let's play it.

Mr. IZRAEL: Drop it.

Mr. GEORGE KELLY (NPR Barbershop Regular): It's not clean, hipster fun. It's just a lack of thinking. This is a situation where I don't' think there necessarily needs to be black faces at the top. I'll settle for smart white faces. This is a law enforcement agency with more than 15,000 employees, second largest investigative agency in the federal government. There really needs to be some intelligence.

MARTIN: Clean, hipster fun.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: There's a lot here, guys. In the 23 page report, it shows in one of the footnotes, for example, that assistant secretary of ICE, Julie Myers, ordered the relocation of the person who was caught in black face, who by the way was an ICE attorney. He wasn't some mid-level flunky. And he was quoted as saying, "I'm a Jamaican inmate from Chrome." And Chrome is known as a notorious immigration facility in Miami, Florida for Haitians, Hondurans, and Latin Americans that's been known for rampant sexual abuse and things like that.

And what's really interesting is this is straight out of the Republican playbook because Secretary Julie Myers is the niece of Former Joints of Chiefs of Staff Richard Myers is married to DHS Secretary Michael Chertoff's Former Chief of Staff who is the cousin of Republican Senator Kit Bond. If this is not Republican incest, I don't know what it is.

MARTIN: Wait, wait. Hold up. What's the relevance of who she's married to?

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

Mr. IFTIKHAR: It shows the level and the magnitude of cronyism in the Bush administration. She had to be appointed during a recess appointment. Even Republican senators question whether she was even qualified to become assistant secretary.

MARTIN: I'm sorry, did she go to the man's house and pick the uniform out for him? I mean, it's bad judgment. But I'm sorry, somebody else help me out here.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: We're not even sure if she like, quote, "covered it up." I mean, she ordered the destruction of these pictures that were in this camera. Her defense is she said well, I knew they were offensive. I didn't want them shown...

Mr. IZRAEL: Nah.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: Hold on. By some agency brochure by accident. So that's plausible, implausible, or whatever, but I think the problem is people are trying to couch this in, sort of, the she is so young. She is someone who came in with no law enforcement background. This is like, as Arsalan points out, this is like shades of brownie at FEMA. So there's legitimate criticism of that. My problem is that we have to differentiate between the offense, which is a black-faced skit that slaps on racial ground and on immigrant grounds, versus the destruction of the property of these photos. Because if in fact she destroyed the photos to cover up, then that's ten times more important than who showed up in black face.

Mr. IZRAEL: Yo Nick, get some of this here

Mr. CHARLES: I think that the first offense is that the person who picked the uniform, if anybody has been to Chrome as I have, it's an orange uniform, it's not a striped uniform. Secondly, the person got an award from Julie Myers. Did she not award them a prize? And then she thought better of it and said, you know something? This might be deemed offensive, and therefore I'm going to go back. Now, you can take her at her word and be, you know, in la-la land and say, she did it for the betterment of the organization, and she was thinking, this is offensive. Or you can think, you know something, I screwed up. I should have killed this in the bud. I should have said let's not take photographs. And now that photographs exist, let's kill them. The fact of the matter is that I don't - the whole lineage that A-Train was running down, I'm not with that. But my problem is that these folks and their Halloween skits, their fraternity skits, their sorority skits, they seem to come back to the same theme. They always seem to be picking on people of color, and it makes no sense. You know, there's so many other ways to do satire and do stuff that's funny without having to come back to the same tired old themes.

Mr. IZRAEL: Right. All right. Well, you know what, let's keep it moving forward. For some odd reason, Absolut Vodka has a PR hangover after their ad showing a redrawn map of America where Mexico took up a good piece of the United States had to be pulled. I wonder who's buying now. Reuben, the art, did you dig the ad, bro?

Mr. NAVARRETTE: The way the ad looked, it was sort of pre-1948 what the southwest looked like and what the North America looked like with Mexico so much more expansive, with the borders of Mexico going all the way up to Oregon and on to Oklahoma. Mexico came in and swallowed up the southwest, so. I dug the ad, I didn't dig the way that it played out here or the way that Absolut Vodka sort of caved into that kind of pressure. Ultimately pulling the ad in the 11th hour and, you know, apologizing for this offence. This got blown way out of proportion. This is about selling vodka. And, you know, forget the fact that vodka margaritas are not the rage in Mexico...

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

Mr. IFTIKHAR: That's true.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: And maybe Absolut are not going to be selling this south of the border. I think this became a proxy for what a lot of people feel about the immigration debate. And suddenly this ad, which is a harmless ad, that was only meant to be seen south of the border becomes, like, I don't know, some sort of signal to all those Mexican Americans up here in the U.S. to take back the southwest so we're sending out code through magazine ads? This just got really nutty.

MARTIN: Can I ask a question? How is this any different from that New York magazine cover that is on countless dorm room walls? Where, you know, Brooklyn, Queens, Manhattan, the Bronx and Staten Island take up, like, half of the United States.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: That's true, though, that's true.

MARTIN: And everything else is reduced to like - well, what's the difference?

Mr. CHARLES: That ad was great, except it would have been more authentic if they'd done Julio ad, for tequila. Which I would have enjoyed a lot more than Absolut Vodka, you know, I'm with you on that. As far as the New York ad. The New York ad is an old ad from way back in - when it was an intellectual thing where all the smart people are in, you know, in New York and all of sudden there is a big wide expanse and then there's California and the coast. As far as the Absolut ad, I found nothing wrong with it. You know, it's one of those things where people are so sensitized these days to immigration and the brown hoards coming across the borders that they are trying to fence in. That, you know, people just get over worked for no reason.

Mr. IZRAEL: A-Train, I think the ad was put out there specifically to agitate this kind of conversation. What do you think?

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

Mr. IFTIKHAR: I agree with you, Jimi.

MARTIN: So, we're suckers.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Conspiracy theorists live.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: Well, you know, I think, you know, for the minute men and the Tancredos of the world, I think that they utterly gasped when they saw this ad, and I agree that it was blown way out of proportion. But I also think that it does, you know, call into the question, you know, the jingoistic nature of many of out debates in American society. Obviously the immigration debate, you know, being front and center on that. And so I think that it was overblown and I'm disappointed that Absolut buckled to the pressure.

MARTIN: If you're just joining us you're listening to Tell Me More from NPR News and we're having our weekly visit to the Barbershop, with Jimi Izrael, Ruben Navarrette, Nick Charles and Arsalan Iftikhar. Back to you, Jimi.

Mr. IZRAEL: All right. Speaking of things that have been overblown, a supporter of John McCain is in the doghouse for what some think was him comparing Barack Obama to Tiger Woods. Yo, we got tape on that somewhere, don't we Michel?

MARTIN: A little editorializing there Jimi, but, sure, I'll play it so that the other people can have the information and make up their minds for themselves.

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

Mr. IZRAEL: Right. Just for themselves.

MARTIN: Let's hear is so we can all decide.

Mr. DAVID BELLAVIA (Vice Chairman, Vets For Freedom): Rest assured, that men like Senator McCain, will be the goal and the men that my two young boys will emulate and admire. You can have your Tiger Woods, we've got Senator McCain.

SOUNDBITE OF CHEERING AND CLAPPING

MARTIN: That was "Vets For Freedom" co-founder, David Bellavia, at a pro McCain rally, and I don't know, it may or may not be relevant, but the Masters is starting this week.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: I'll bet all the money in my pockets that the guy didn't know that the Masters was starting this weekend.

Mr. IZRAEL: OK, well, I'll take that bet and double it, that the Masters was the top of mind, because he is probably a golf fan, and this had nothing to do with any slick slide references to Barack Obama or anything like that. You know, sometimes, a cigar is just a cigar.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: Jimi...

IZRAEL: All right, A-Train.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: ...he could have said you can have your Tom Brady, you can have your Brett Favre, you can have your Dale Earnhardt, Jr. I think it was a deliberate use of Tiger Woods and I am going to go on the record and say that I am Tiger Woods also. I think that, you know, we challenge rhetoric when Jeremiah Wright and Senator Barack Obama says something, but why don't we challenge something when the white candidates says something also. I'm sorry, I'm sick and tired of this double standard.

Mr. IZRAEL: Ruben, help me out here.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Well, I don't think, I'm not going to go so far as to say that, you know, necessarily, apologies to Jimi that he was thinking about he Masters. I think he was thinking about Barack Obama, but the more I thought about this, the fact that you would compare Barack Obama to Tiger Woods is nothing but a compliment. It elevates Barack Obama to a different level, to a higher level. And I think that ultimately, it sort of hurts the guy who made the comment infinitely more than it hurts Barack Obama or his supporters. If anything, John McCain wants to pull this guy aside and say, hey, next time, do me a favor, don't compare my opponent to Tiger Woods.

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

Mr. IFTIKHAR: That's good, that's good, that's good.

Mr. CHARLES: Honestly, I'm not Tiger Woods. Most of us are more like John Daly. I think the Tiger Woods note was a substitution for Obama. Whether it was - it meant he means it or not, he screwed it up because he was going to say one of two things when he said "goal," it sounded like "ghoul." He was going to say John McCain is either the gold standard or the goal. For those of us - and he didn't get that out and then he didn't get out the Tiger Woods thing efficiently. So, I think it was a matter of efficiency and execution, maybe he had something in there but he didn't get it out the right way, and therefore it came out the way it did.

Mr. IZRAEL: All right, well, in more McCain news, you know he has a fan club of his own. You know, I guess somebody did, like, a take off of the Weather Girls "It's Raining Men." And I guess it's...

MARTIN: It's your screensaver, Jimi, why are you trying to act like you aren't playing...

IZRAEL: Here we go, here we go...

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

MARTIN: We'll play it for the folks who haven't memorized it as Jimi has.

SOUNDBITE OF SONG "IT'S RAINING MCCAIN"

MCCAIN GIRLS: We're you're McCain girls, and have we got news for you. You better believe it, get ready all you lonely girls, and leave those Democrats at home. All right.

Temperatures rising, Obama's getting low, according to all sources, McCain should get your vote.

In the 2008 election, the forecast calls for rain, the first time in history, it's going to start raining McCain.

It's raining McCain, Halleluiah, It's raining McCain, Amen.

MARTIN: I thought I was going to have to....

Mr. CHARLES: Ouch, ouch...

Mr. CHARLES: Thank you so much for that, Michel.

MARTIN: I thought I was going to have to get oxygen for Arsalan.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: Jimi, Jimi...

Mr. IZRAEL: What was that?

Mr. CHARLES: You know, I love that song, I have danced to that song and Martha Walsh has performed that song, it's one of my favorite old spots in New York City. I am upset, because, also, you look at the three of the women, you know, I'm not talking about you know, trying to be any body type, trying to cast aspersions, but come on, the Obama girl wipes them off the planet. In terms of just the way she performs. And the three of them, they can't sing, at least be able to sing, if you can't perform, sing.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Is that what we are calling the bobama now, the Obama girl's a performer? I love it, Nick, I love it.

Mr. CHARLES: That's right, she is a performer, she's been elevated to the...

Mr. NAVARRETTE: That girl's got talent.

Mr. IZRAEL: A-Train, A-Train, come over in it, come on...

Mr.IFTIHKAR: You know, when I was watching this two-minute video on Youtube, I finally realized what Simon Cowell must have felt like when William Hung was singing "She Bangs" on the American Idol tryouts. That was two minutes that I am never getting back of my life, and it's been viewed a million times so that means two million minutes have been wasted on this video.

Mr. CHARLES: We just wasted, like, four of them.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Same thing, too many people with too much time on their hands, on either side of the party. It doesn't really matter if it's Republicans or Democrats. People are just trying to have right now. They must be bored of the race already.

MARTIN: I love it. I'm sorry, am I the only one?

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Yes.

MARTIN: I think it's hilarious.

Mr. IZRAEL: Michel, it really underlines the importance of the Internet in shaping this election and shaping some of the conversations about the election, you know. Because, I don't think any of us would have seen anything like four or five years ago, you know. And it's interesting that McCain's supporters, at this late date, are deciding, you know, to get out there and come up with something. They should come up with a rap or some kind of waltz, you know, but, like, years ago, you know. I guess...

MARTIN: Hang on, where's John Phillip Sousa when you need him, right?

Mr. IZRAEL: Right, when you're running for president. And with that ladies and gentlemen, we are going to have to call it a wrap. Thank you so much for another session of the Barbershop. I have to hand it over to our resident Diva, Michel Martin.

MARTIN: Thank you, you're just jealous because nobody's made a video for y'all.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: That's true.

MARTIN: That's what it is, you're hating it.

Mr. IZRAEL: Well, they have, but nothing I can put on Youtube.

SOUNDBITE OF LAUGHTER

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Jimi does not speak for the rest of the Barbershop.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: Yes, he does, yes, he does.

MARTIN: Jimi Izrael is a freelance journalist who writes for theroot.com; he joined us from WFSU in Tallahassee, Florida. Ruben Navarrette, who writes for the San Diego Union Tribune and CNN.com joined us form KOGO in San Diego. Nick Charles is a vice president of digital content at bet.com and he joined us from our New York bureau and Arsalan Iftikhar, is a civil rights attorney and contributing editor for Islamica magazine, and he joined us here in our Washington studio.

Gentlemen, thank you.

Mr. IZRAEL: Peace.

Mr. NAVARRETTE: Hey.

Mr. IFTIKHAR: Yep, yep.

Mr. CHARLES: Thank you.

Copyright ©2009 National Public Radio®. All rights reserved. No quotes from the materials contained herein may be used in any media without attribution to National Public Radio. This transcript is provided for personal, noncommercial use only, pursuant to our Terms of Use. Any other use requires NPR's prior permission. Visit our permissions page for further information.

NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by a contractor for NPR, and accuracy and availability may vary. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Please be aware that the authoritative record of NPR's programming is the audio.