Time again for StoryCorps where people sit down with each other to talk about big moments in their lives. Today, James Hanson-Brown and his ex-wife Lisa Combest. They discussed how the end of their marriage deepened their relationship.

LISA COMBEST: We got married January 11th, 1986.


COMBEST: And the minister who married us told me, you guys are the best-matched couple I've ever talked to. I guess we were in our marriage for about a year when I started thinking that something was wrong. Emotionally I was supported, but it was the physical side of things.

HANSON-BROWN: I was looking at everyone else, going, why aren't we like that? And one night, I had this realization and went: I'm gay. And part of me was like, no this can't be, because I love Lisa.

COMBEST: And East Texas, that's not the most wonderful place to come out, either.

HANSON-BROWN: Yeah, Texas is definitely not the San Francisco of the South. So I was terrified. My mother had suspected I was gay all my life, but she wasn't quite supportive. Her idea was that, you know, gays should be rounded up and put on their own little island and left to die.

COMBEST: I remember when you told me that you were gay, I thought, oh, is that all?

HANSON-BROWN: Actually, that's what you said.


HANSON-BROWN: You said, oh my God, is that all? I thought we were growing apart. And we've never really untangled our lives.

COMBEST: Our relationship really has helped me define unconditional love. One of the things that I want to say to you is thank you for having the courage to be honest with yourself, and with me. Since then, you and I have both gone out and found relationships that are wonderful for us.

Right after I had met Todd, you said you wished that I would let myself feel love again, and to allow myself to be loved like I deserved. And so Todd owes you a debt of thanks, because that was when I realized that he was the guy that I wanted to marry. I remember just how thankful I was that you understood me that well.

HANSON-BROWN: We are best friends. You have to have someone like that in your life, that you can count on in any situation, and that you completely love and know that they completely love you. Just in this case, it doesn't happen to be my wife.


NEARY: James Hanson-Brown and Lisa Combest at StoryCorps in Houston, Texas. Their conversation will be archived will be archived with all the others in this project at the Library of Congress. Sign up for the Podcast at

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