< Bloggers' Roundtable: Alicia Keys a Radical?

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Heard on News & Notes

April 21, 2008 - FARAI CHIDEYA, host:

I'm Farai Chideya and you're listening to News & Notes. Is time running out for Hillary Clinton in the race to grab presidential delegates? And Alicia Keys is making waves for criticizing the government and gangsta rap. That's all on today's Bloggers' Roundtable. With us, political commentator Jasmyne Cannick of JasmyneCannick.com, Eric Brown, blogger for the Detroit News's political and government blog and Jay Smooth who videoblogs at IllDoctrine.com. Hi, folks.

Mr. JAY SMOOTH (Blogger, IllDoctrine.com): Hello.

Mr. ERIC BROWN (Blogger, Detroit News): How you doing?

Ms. JASMYNE CANNICK (Blogger, JasmyneCannick.com): Hello.

CHIDEYA: I am doing great. Let's start out with politics. The Associated Press says Barack Obama seems on track to finish the primary season less than 100 delegates shy of the magic number needed to clinch the nomination. So that means he won't have it in hand, but he'll be so close he can taste it. If that's the case, it could be difficult for Senator Clinton to keep up momentum and stay in the race. Now, on Friday, Former Senators and current superdelegates Sam Nunn and David Boren jumped on the Obama bandwagon. Robert Reich served as Secretary of Labor for President Clinton. He also endorsed Obama. So, Jasmyne, why has Senator Clinton not been successful in wooing these superdelegates?

Ms. CANNICK: I think people see through her. I think people - you know, this race has turned so nasty over the past few weeks. I think that's turned off a lot of people, including superdelegates. I know it's turned me off. I don't appreciate some of the comments that are being made. I think that Senator Obama has made a clear case for why he is, or why he should be the next president of the United States. And I think that that message is reaching people regardless of the fact that, you know, Senator Clinton continues to bring up, you know, Reverend Wright and certain ties that he has to people. And, of course, the overblown media hype around his bitter comments, which I think that a lot of people, including myself, identified with.

CHIDEYA: You know, Eric, and, Jay, I want to ask each of you, first off, do you think that this race has gotten nasty. I mean, I'm coming from a different perspective of having covered politics now for, well, many years. Let's just put it that way. And things are often mean, bitter, nasty. It seems to be just part of the package. I mean, Eric, first, do you think that this is a nasty campaign?

Mr. BROWN: Well, I wouldn't say nasty so to speak. I would say more or less it has definitely gotten or has become obsolete, and that was proven by the debate last week on ABC. People want to hear the issues. That's what people want to talk about. And the people, such as moderators, are not willing to talk about the issues. And that's one of the reasons why so many people are turned off by politics because you don't give people an opportunity, the candidates that is, a chance to come before the people and talk about the issues.

I don't need to know about who's wearing a lapel pin, who's lying about ducking sniper fire in Bosnia. Tell me about what is going on in the economy, what you're going to do for the economy once you become president. Tell me what you're going to do about gas prices. Tell me what you're going to do about universal health care. Those are the things that are of concern to me. And the nastiness that goes with it is exactly why people are able to identify more so with Barack Obama than so his opponent.

CHIDEYA: Jay, what do you think?

Mr. SMOOTH: Well, I think, you know, compared to other races historically it may not be that nasty. But it looks unusually nasty because these are two candidates who are so similar, that it seems ugly to see people and their supporters fight when their positions are so similar and they have really such similar visions. And I think the problem is that just this nominating system is really ill-equipped to handle such a close race with two strong candidates that are so similar. I mean, it just drags on and on.

And each candidate has to think of new talking points and try it out every single day. And the media has to think of new things to say about what they said every day. And since they're so similar on the issues, that endless conversation strays further and further away from the issues until we're arguing over lapel pins and airplane trips with Sinbad. And I think it's unfortunate that the system is playing out that way. And I'm certainly looking forward to when we can start the real conversation comparing one of these candidates to McCain because then they'll actually be something to talk about.

CHIDEYA: Jasmyne, you're someone who obviously is plugged into politics 24/7. But when you talk to your friends of yours who may be interested but not obsessed, are they, kind of, tuning out at this point, or? What do you think people are doing at this point?

Ms. CANNICK: I think a lot of people are tuning out. Even people like myself. Yes, it's true I am plugged into politics, but even I have to some degree tuned out just because of, like, what the other bloggers have said. We're not really touching the issues. I want to talk about why I'm paying four dollars a gallon for gas here in Los Angeles. I don't want to talk about who's wearing what. I don't want to, you know, hear over-and-over about a bitter comment.

And so in that respect, I think a lot of people, again including myself, have tuned out to some degree. And I am ready to start the real race. The race between the Democratic candidate against, you know, John McCain, that's what I'm ready for.

CHIDEYA: Eric, how much do you think people know about what a president does? And I bring that up only because when you think about things like why are we paying four dollars for gas, or, you know, any other number of issues. There are a number of different factors, government sector and private sector that can play into that. And the president does not have absolute authority to change everything. The president has some authorities to shape policies and to make certain executive decisions. Do people - do you think, for example, if people are looking to Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama or John McCain to fix their problems that they don't understand what the limits on presidential power are?

Mr. BROWN: Well, if the Jay Leno piece with regards to jaywalking is any indication, people don't know much about much when it comes to politics. Most people cannot even tell you who one or even two of their senators are from the state that they are from. So I think that until people are really in-tune to what politics is all about - the role of the president, the legislative branch as well as the judicial branch, which you're supposed to learn in middle school - then it's just a name, recognition contest, so to speak.

But one of the things that people should really be paying attention to is why is it that certain people that were in the first Clinton administration not endorsing Hillary Clinton. That's a telltale sign as to what she is about, why they're not endorsing her. But it's unfortunate that people are not more involved in politics, or at least have a better understanding of what it's about.

CHIDEYA: I want to move on to a topic that has some political undertones but it comes to us from the entertainment world. I'm talking about Alicia Keys. She is making headlines. She's on the cover of this month's Blender magazine. And an article quotes her as saying, "Gangsta rap was a ploy to convince black people to kill each other." And when the reporter asked who the ploy was by, she reportedly responded, "the government."

Now she's released a statement saying she was misrepresented, and her comments were in no way, quote, "suggesting the government is responsible for creating this genre of rap music." So the controversial quotes actually were removed from Blender.com. Jay, she's not the only one who feels this way if she feels this way. It seems as if she's saying, no, I didn't actually say that.

But there are a lot of folks who believe that Tupac and Biggie were essentially assassinated, that their beefs were stoked by the government, that there have been cover ups. There are all sorts of beliefs. What's the conversation - the state of the conversation about these issues, regardless of whether or not Alicia Keys actually said what the magazine said she said.

Mr. SMOOTH: Well, I think, as has been said, this is similar in some ways to the Reverend Wright situation in that there's a certain amount of shock in the media reaction. But this is a conversation that is very commonplace among people inside hip-hop culture. And, I think, certainly the facts don't support the idea that they were assassinated or that the government created the genre known as gangsta rap.

But I don't think it's crazy to be suspicious of something going on when you look at the history of the American government and things like the COINTELPRO operation that went on in the '60s and '70s. And to me the problem is not so much that it's crazy, just that it is counterproductive because getting too caught up in conspiracy theories distracts you from figuring out which parts of the problem you can control.

Because even if you look at how the COINTELPRO operation worked, they looked at groups like the Black Panthers and figured out what were the internal weaknesses of the group and how you could try to use those internal weaknesses to bring it down. So if you think that a COINTELPRO type thing is going on now, the way you should counteract that is by looking at your own internal weaknesses and trying to get your own stuff together.

So the big concern that I have, even though some conspiracy theories may be true, is that when we get caught up obsessing over that it distracts us from the work at hand that we can do to improve our own situation.

CHIDEYA: Eric, what about the aspect of criticism of gangsta rap? You know there's actually now been a reply by 50 Cent who said, I don't like people who don't like me. That statement changes my perception of Alicia Keys totally. It's just not really a bright comment. Now the reality is plenty of people criticize gangsta rap. Again, is this just an issue where, you know, it's about time that some people raise these questions?

Mr. BROWN: Well, to a certain degree it's much ado about nothing. I think Jay hit the nail on the head. It's counter-productive, number one. And number two, there are more important issues. This is just my opinion. There are more important issues that we can be talking about as relates to black life in America than talking about conspiracies as it relates to two entertainers that ended up dead. I mean, I'm not that - you know, I find it ironic and kind of hypocritical when you have rappers talk about all these conspiracies. Or even anyone in the entertainment field. But at the same time, they continue to play the role of the pseudo gangster and make money off of spewing the type of lyrics that they spew.

CHIDEYA: And Jasmyne, when you look at this. How much of a sense of internal critique should come from people in the music industry? I mean, what makes this situation difficult to talk about is that, you know, she's saying that she did not actually put these comments up and we're still waiting for more news on that. But don't entertainers have a right to be a part of a conversation about not just the future of music as an industry but also about what it does to us as a society? Shouldn't there be more entertainers who actually are part of a debate and a dialogue?

Ms. CANNICK: I mean, I think it's good any time you can get, you know, any of the entertainers, I guess, to speak on a, quote, unquote, "political issue." But I have to say, like, you know, until this story was brought to me by the producer, that we were going to talk about it, it's not something that I even cared about or even cared to blog about. Because it's just - it's not important. I mean, I find it very interesting that 50 Cent could find the wherewithal to issue a response to this considering some of the madness that's come out of his mouth. I don't think he needs to be criticizing anyone.

I think I would echo the sentiments of, you know, Eric and Jay and just say that, you know, let's talk about gangsta rap. But let's talk about it in present day sense. Let's talk about what it's doing to us today and what we continue to allow it to do in our communities. You know, I do follow conspiracy theories on certain things. I do think there is something behind the whole gangsta rap phenomenon. You know, I am a west coast girl, been around for the Eazy-E and all of that, came up through all of that.

But today, when I look at gangsta rap, and I look at the influence that it has had on our young adults, you know, that's - those are the discussions that I want to have on how, as entertainers, they can, you know, look at some of the words that are coming out of their mouth and how it is influencing our kids and what they are doing to our community with those words.

Mr. BROWN: I agree.

CHIDEYA: Well, you're listening to NPR's News & Notes. I'm Farai Chideya. And if you're just tuning in, with me on today's bloggers' roundtable we've got political commentator Jasmyne Cannick of JasmyneCannick.com, Eric Brown, a blogger for the Detroit News' political and government blog, and Jay Smooth who videoblogs at IllDoctrine.com.

Eric, we've got one last topic and it's a government one. So it will be good for you. The former HUD secretary, Alphonso Jackson, may be out of a cabinet job, but he's still in the news. He resigned and now he's under investigation for possibly enriching himself and friends with lucrative government contracts. Now, the New York Times says a developer friend received a 127 million dollar contract to rebuild the New Orleans housing project. That developer's company paid Jackson more than 250,000 dollars in fees.

And you know, supporters of Jackson say his critics are going after him because he was enriching other black Republicans. The Times said that in the years he was in office, HUD contracts to African-Americans went from 14 percent before he was there to 25 percent. Is this one of those, you're going after me 'cause I'm black things? Or is there smoke and possibly fire?

Mr. BROWN: Well, I'm not big on the victimization of blacks. But one thing that blacks in politics and any high profile position have to always be careful of is to make sure all your i's are dotted and t's are crossed because all it takes is a perception that you're doing something wrong. And if he found a way to make sure that minority contracts were increased because part of the government mantra is to ensure that minorities are involved in all these different types of projects.

So, on the one hand, you want to say this is what we're about, to ensure that everyone has an equal footing as relates to getting these types of contracts. But then because the amount of contracts to minorities goes up, someone wants to make a big deal about it. Then you start investigating people and you try and find out, OK, where's this extra money coming from that he has in his bank account? I mean, I think that's ludicrous.

You can't say how you want to improve the involvement of all races, then you find a way to say, OK, he did something wrong because those people that he reached out to give more contracts to look like him. I mean, that's not fair as relates to that. But, again, you have to be careful. Make sure the i's are dotted and t's are crossed. Don't give them a reason to come after you in the future.

CHIDEYA: Jasmyne, some folks will say, OK, maybe Alphonso Jackson wasn't the cleanest tool in the shed but then they'll point to someone like Vice President Dick Cheney. He was a former employee of Halliburton, which went on to get no-bid contracts for providing services during the war. The whole question of government contracts is one that some folks say we should take a closer look at. What do you think?

Ms. CANNICK: Well, absolutely, we should take a closer look at it. And I am glad you brought up Dick Cheney because I was about to do the same thing. I think, you know, one of the - working around so many black politicians, you know, it is a - if you are a black politician, you always have to make sure your i's are dotted and your t's are crossed. And you always have to know that you are going to be scrutinized more than anyone else is. And so I find it really hard to believe that, you know, Mr. Jackson would allow himself to be in this sort of position. So I think that maybe there is something to the fact that maybe because he is an African-American and these were, you know, minority contracts, that maybe, you know, because I just find it really hard to believe that knowing - I'm sure he knows as a black man in this particular administration that he is going to be scrutinized.

CHIDEYA: Hey, hey, people have found money in refrigerators.

Ms. CANNICK: I know, I know.

CHIDEYA: I mean, I'm never surprised by anything in politics.

Ms. CANNICK: I'm not surprised either, but I just find that hard to believe that he wouldn't take note of that and be very careful. So, I mean, it will be interesting to find out what happens. I would never go so far to say that, you know, blacks in positions like this, you know, would never do anything wrong. Because, you're right, we have found thousands of dollars in freezers and so on and so forth. And let's just hope that as the investigation continues that he comes out clean.

CHIDEYA: All right. Well, I'm sorry, Jay, we don't have time for a final comment from you. But I want to thank all of you.

Ms. CANNICK: Thank you.

Mr. BROWN: All right.

Mr. SMOOTH: Thank you.

CHIDEYA: That was political commentator Jasmyne Cannick of JasmyneCannick.com. She was in our NPR West studios. Eric Brown, blogger for the Detroit News' political and government blog, and Jay Smooth who videoblogs at IllDoctrine.com. He was at our NPR New York studios.

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CHIDEYA: Next on News & Notes, Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton are scrambling to get support in Pennsylvania. We'll talk to voters in the state about the issues that matter to them most.

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CHIDEYA: You're listening to News & Notes from NPR News.

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