Talking with Iran in the 21st Century

ROBERT SIEGEL, host:

With us in the studio is George Perkovich, who's vice president for studies at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace.

George Perkovich, you've studied Iran for the past 15 years. You heard what Ambassador Zarif just had to say. First of all, on his view of the nuclear weapons or of nuclear research in Iran, fairly straight or not? What would you say?

Mr. GEORGE PERKOVICH (Carnegie Endowment for International Peace): Well, I mean, he's straight in arguing that, you know, they want to go forward and they claim to have rights to nuclear energy, but the problem that's being faced is that the International Atomic Energy Agency, not the United States but an international agency, has documented 18 years of violations of the rules by Iran.

And some of those violations are very serious, and so that agency has asked Iran, give us the answers. Explain that this is entirely consistent with a peaceful nuclear program. And Iran hasn't been able to provide those answers and then more recently has not supplied the cooperation, the transparency, that the agency feels it needs, and so on that one, he's not telling the whole story.

SIEGEL: Is he accurate in saying that policy toward Iran has been pretty much the same from the days of President Khatami, widely regarded as a reformer here, through the days of President Ahmadinejad, who is the firebrand and who's made remarks that have been interpreted as calling for wiping Israel off the map, for example.

Mr. PERKOVICH: Well, it's actually interesting. Iran's nuclear activities and determination to have a nuclear fuel production capability is consistent. In other words, it started under, well before President Khatami, but he defended it, and the current president has, too.

What's really changed is the rhetoric and the demeanor of Iran under President Ahmadinejad, which is much more hostile, and also what has grown is the sense of threat by Iran's neighbors because of this.

SIEGEL: Well, George Perkovich, thank you very much for talking with us.

Mr. PERKOVICH: Thank you.

SIEGEL: George Perkovich of the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace talking about the interview we just hear with Iranian Ambassador Javid Zarif.

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