TONY COX, host:
Back in 1969, ballet wasn't seen as a dance form normally associated with African-Americans but against the backdrop of the continuing fight for civil rights. One man was inspired to change that view. Fast forward 40 years. Thee dance theater of Harlem has seen thousands of black and Latino students passed through its doors and it continues to push the boundaries of this classic dance form. Joining me now is dance theater of Harlem's creator, Arthur Mitchell and Virginia Johnson, a former prima ballerina with the DTH. Welcome both of you to News & Notes.
Mr. ARTHUR MITCHELL (Founder, Dance Theater of Harlem): Hi, Tony. How are you?
Ms. VIRGINIA JOHNSON (Former Prima Ballerina, Dance Theater of Harlem): How are you? Nice to be here.
COX: I'm fine thank you and happy anniversary. As I mentioned, you started along with another person, the Dance Theater of Harlem 40 years ago. Talk about what inspired you back then.
Mr. MITCHELL: Myself personally or Virginia?
COX: Well, the figures at that time - the fallacy was that black people couldn't do classical ballet. And I said, well, who said that? No one could tell me who actually said it, but that was in the field. And Jackie Robinson was breaking into baseball, so I said, you know what, I'll break into classical ballet. And I had gone to the high school performing arts here in New York City and I won a scholarship to the School of American Ballet, which is the official school for New York City ballet. And I studied there and when I was around 21, that's when they decided to take me into the company. And I danced there for 15 years. And at that time when I went to the school, there are only two people of color taking classes there. One was Louis Johnson and the other one is Chito Riviera and myself. We were only the minorities in the entire school. But when I graduated and I got into New York City Ballet, there just wasn't a African-American or Negro, whichever word you want to use from that time, in any of the major companies in America around the world. So, I just felt that I would do it. And I got accepted into New York City Ballet and Mr. Balanchine and Lincoln Kirstein become my mentor in a sense.
COX: You know, it was odd, as I remember, in the sense that black people have long been identified with dancing and yet this type of dancing was considered foreign to us and that's what I meant when I said, odd, Virginia, how difficult was it in the ballet world changing the perception that people of color either aren't interested in or perhaps were not good at this type of dancing?
Ms. JOHNSON: Well, it's an ongoing mission. I was in the company back in 1969, and it was a point of time when it wasn't just that white people were saying that they don't have the bodies and they don't have the temperament for doing classical ballet. Black people were also saying, well, that's not our art form, that's a European art form, why are you even involved in it? But you know, the point is, that you set yourself to do something that you want to do and you put yourself through the training and have the focus to pursue something that you believe and then you dream of and you should have a place to do it. And that's what Arthur Mitchell created for us with the Dance Theater of Harlem.
COX: You know, Arthur, I was going to ask you about that because it seems to me, as a person who has watched and enjoyed the Dance Theater of Harlem over the years. And one of the things that you did and continued to do was to expand the movement of ballet and to incorporate perhaps some of the kinds of, I hesitate to use the word steps, but I can't think of anything better...
Mr. MITCHELL: It's a dynamic that's very different from what most people perceived as classical ballet. And what I tell my dance artists, I say, don't be classical because that's an affectation. But be classic, and then you're unique. And there's an energy and even Mr. Balanchine, when he came to America, he said, you know, I choreographed for the American Kinetic Energy. There's a speed and a rhythm here that no other country has but then attitude here that no other country has. But then added to that what we have as African-Americans takes the dance to another level. And even though it's a European art form, the techniques of it is wonderful. Now, if you take that technique and add your own things to it, it gives another dimension. And I always say, the elegance is inherent to man whether he or she is courtier of the Louis XIV court or a Watusi warrior that's inherent to the human being. But then you take the technique and put that together, it gives it another look.
COX: Now, in today's world Virginia, young people are heavily involved in hip-hop and the beats associated with that, is there a way and have you been able to and were you interested in including or expanding the ballet to include those kinds of movements.
Ms. JOHNSON: Absolutely. Ballet is a language, hip-hop is a language. There are no walls between them. I think that what we're trying to do as artists is communicate. And so you use the tools around you to make that happen. I don't think there's any opposition between ballet and hip-hop. And I think that there are certainly classes that are taught in the schools. Dancers no longer have to say, oh, I only do this kind of dances. Dancers today are challenged to do every kind of dancing. And that's great for the art form and that's great for our public too.
COX: There's another thing that she mentioned, Arthur, that I'd like to get you to talk about. When you look at ballet, you look at the physique or the physicality of the dancers and they are - they're strong and they're graceful. And if I am overweight, let's say, or if I'm a person who's not necessarily in good condition, I might be intimidated by the thought of trying to participate in something like that.
Mr. MITCHELL: Well, the art of particularly dance has become so popular in the world and particularly in America. Everyone now - if you turn on your television, there's a dance show just about every evening now and - but the thing is we are becoming much more physically aware of taking care of ourselves today. And so everyone's going to the gym or they're taking class and they got hip-hop lessons, they've got Latin moves now to lose weight. So, it's becoming part of our perception that dance is just not an art form that's stuck up in a loft somewhere that you cannot relate to. And I think you look at the growth of social dancing in all the public schools and all the kids that are participating, it's amazing when you see something like Dulaine - Pierre Dulaine has done. Three thousand or 4,000 kids in just New York City are studying social dancing, but that gives up a sense of awareness, a sense of manner, a sense of grace and a politeness to each other. And I think that what's happening with the hip-hop and people like that - I said to one of them, I said, you know, if you get in a hit show and you have to do eight performances a week for 52 weeks a year, you better have some technique. You're doing what you want to do because you think it's wonderful. But having to reproduce that exactly, you have to get the technique and that's why the classical ballet is your strongest technical base. Very few people realize that Katherine Dunn(ph) with an ethnic company, they had a compulsory ballet class everyday. It's not that you want to be a ballet dancer like a Russian or English person or Danish. It's taking that technique so that you can reproduce whatever you want to do anytime, have the clarity and the line and the perfection.
COX: Let me ask you this last question. I appreciate both of you coming on. I'm very happy to talk with you. How would you say really briefly that when the Dance Theatre of Harlem is mentioned now, how is the reaction different than it was when you were first getting going back in the early 1970s?
Mr. MITCHELL: Well, one of the things that we always prided ourselves with is our education and community outreach program and the fact that we were based and still are in Harlem. When I first taught it, people kept saying, ballet, Harlem, no. They didn't see the connection. Now, young people come from all over the world because the magic word is Harlem. When we tour the world, they want to come to America. They want to come to New York and they all want to come to Harlem. And so that is the carat(ph), shall we say, and the school always has flourish. It was the company that had to go out and be ambassadors to the world showing, yes, we can and we come from Harlem.
COX: Absolutely.
Mr. MITCHELL: That's what blew people's mind.
COX: And you have done that very well. Congratulations once again. And thank you both, Virginia and Arthur, for coming on.
Mr. MITCHELL: Well, thank you very much for having us.
Ms. JOHNSON: Thank you. It's a pleasure.
COX: That was the Dance Theatre Harlem's creator Arthur Mitchell and Virginia Johnson, a founding member and former dance theatre of Harlem prima donna - prima ballerina, excuse me. They joined me from our NPR studios in New York.
That's our show for today. Glad you could join us. To listen to the show or subscribe to the podcast, visit our Web site, nprnewsandnotes.org. To join the conversation or sign up for the newsletter, visit our blog, nprnewsandviews.org. News & Notes was created by NPR News and the African-American Public Radio Consortium. Tomorrow, the International Criminal Court struck out boldly last week with an arrest warrant for the Sudanese president. But will this lead to further destabilization? We'll have details in our Africa Update.
COX: I'm Tony Cox. This is News & Notes.
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