FARAI CHIDEYA, host:
And we've got our bloggers on the case. The Nation of Islam leader, Louis Farrakhan, praises Barack Obama, and internal struggles at the NAACP threaten the group's future. With us we've got Wayne Bennett; he's an attorney who blogs as The Field Negro; Michael Fauntroy, assistant professor of public policy at George Mason University. He blogs at michaelfountroy.com; and Debra Dickerson, author of the books "An American Story" and "The End of Blackness"; she blogs at motherjones.com. Welcome.
Mr. WAYNE BENNETT (Blogger): Thanks for having us.
Mr. MICHAEL FAUNTROY (Blogger): Thanks for having us.
Ms. DEBRA DICKERSON (Blogger): Thanks for having us.
CHIDEYA: So let's talk about Louis Farrakhan, the head of the Nation of Islam. At an annual celebration in Chicago over the weekend he praised Barack Obama. He talked about how, you know, in his words we are witnessing the phenomenal rise of a man of color in a country that has persecuted us because of our color, and he also compared Obama to the Nation of Islam founder, Fard Muhammad, who also had a white mother. Here's what he said.
Minister LOUIS FARRAKHAN (Nation of Islam Leader): A black man with a white mother could turn out to be one who can lift America from her fall.
CHIDEYA: Obviously a little faint there, but he said that a black man with a white mother could lift America from her fall. You know, what do you think about that, Debra, that, you know, decoding of the racial coding, first of all?
Ms. DICKERSON: Well, I think this has everything to do with Minister Farrakhan trying to rehabilitate himself and trying to regain - trying to gain some sort of mainstream legitimacy. If he really was on Barack Obama's side, he wouldn't say anything about him.
So I think that's the first thing you have to look at. I think that's about Minister Farrakhan, you know, as his days start to dwindle down. He's had some health issues. You know, he's apologized about Malcolm X. I think this is primarily about that. And I think there's a sort of recklessness there.
I'm fascinated - I read about it, but in hearing him, this is off-topic, but I'm fascinated about how a white woman could have a black child, but black women can only have black children. You know, I just - you know, Asian women can only have Asian children. I just think that's really, really interesting.
But I think it also flies in the face of the rhetoric and the beliefs of the Nation of Islam up to this point, given Barack Obama's politics, which really have to be anathema to this whole transcendent, non-aggressive, not - not blaming and not requiring apologies and this not in-your-face kind of stuff.
I'm not an adherent of the Nation of Islam, but I've got to say I'm a little embarrassed for them. I think this is embarrassing for them.
CHIDEYA: All right, well, there's a lot there, and we're going to have to talk - we're planning to talk about identity some other time. We've only got a little bit of time, but we're going to come back later.
Wayne, what do you think? Is this a statement that is designed, as Debra says, to rehabilitate the image of the Nation of Islam?
Mr. BENNETT: I certainly think he is thinking about his legacy as an African-American leader. I just think - I agree with her that it really didn't help Barack Obama. I don't know if it was intentional or not. I think he was just really saying how he felt at the time about the movement.
I think she's right in that, you know, it's kind of, you know, he's getting on the bandwagon a little late. And being from Chicago like Barack Obama, I think there's a little more - it adds a little more interesting sidebar to the dynamic. I'm not too sure of their relationship. I know - I saw where Barack Obama denounced him strongly in the debate, and I was a little bit surprised about that. But no, I agree with her for the most part that it's hurting him when it's going to help him, him meaning Barack Obama, and I just thought it was kind of interesting, yeah.
CHIDEYA: Well, you know what, we're going to talk more about that after a break. I'm going to ask you guys to stay with us. We are talking, the Bloggers Roundtable - Wayne Bennett, Debra Dickerson and Michael Fauntroy. We're also going to talk with Sudhir Venkatesh, who spent seven years with Chicago's notorious Black Kings street gang.
(Soundbite of music)
CHIDEYA: I'm Farai Chideya and this is NEWS & NOTES. We are back with our Bloggers Roundtable. We've got Wayne Bennett, an attorney who blogs as The Field Negro. Michael Fauntroy, assistant professor of public policy at George Mason University; he blogs at michaelfountroy.com. And Debra Dickerson, author of the books "An American Story" and "The End of Blackness"; she blogs at motherjones.com.
So welcome back, folks, and we're talking about Minister Farrakhan. At last night's debate in Ohio, moderated by NBC's Tim Russert, Obama responded to the support he got from Minister Farrakhan.
(Soundbite of debate)
Senator BARACK OBAMA (Democrat, Illinois; Presidential Candidate): I obviously can't censor him, but it is not support that I sought.
Mr. TIM RUSSERT (Moderator): Do you reject his support?
Sen. OBAMA: Well, Tim, you know, I can't say to somebody that he can't say that he thinks I'm a good guy.
(Soundbite of laughter)
Sen. OBAMA: You know, I have been very clear in my denunciations of him and his past statements.
CHIDEYA: Michael, Minister Farrakhan has been a bit of a third rail in racial politics. How should Senator Obama have played his cards? I mean he's going to definitely tick off some people who don't want him to appear to kowtow to mainstream opinion.
Mr. FAUNTROY: Farai, it's as if you were reading my mind. You know, Farrakhan is radioactive, even after all these years, and I think that the controversy around these comments sort of underscores all of that. and as I see it, you know, Barack Obama, in my opinion, has been allowed to run a deracialized campaign, which I completely understand given the nature of American politics.
But at some point he's going to have to deal with some of the uniquely - the issues that are of unique importance to African-Americans, and unfortunately for him this whole controversy with Farrakhan sort of makes it a bit more difficult for him to do that on his terms.
CHIDEYA: Debra, let's talk specifically about some of the issues around Minister Farrakhan, specifically, you know, allegations that his rhetoric is baldly anti-Semitic. How do you fall on that?
Ms. DICKERSON: Well, first of all, to the sort of basic political point, I think Senator Clinton thought she was playing a winning hand, and I think Barack Obama handled it perfectly. I think she lost on that one. She called his - she gave him an ultimatum, and he called her bluff. So I think he handled it consummately, and she made him look kind of - he made her look kind of silly, denounce, reject, potato, potahto, you want me to say reject? Fine, I reject. So he called her bluff. I thought he handled it perfectly.
I am not up on what Minister Farrakhan has said in the last year or two, but I don't think that anything he's said in the last year or two can undo, you know, a near generation of unconscionable rhetoric. I don't think, you know, short of some major, you know, public apology and sort of ritual communistic-type, you know, self-criticism, I don't know what he could do to undo what he has done with the political stances as leader of the Nation of Islam.
So I couldn't say how it squares with what he's done lately, but I will say that I don't think there's anything he can undo the legacy that he created for himself.
CHIDEYA: Wayne, I'm going to get to you in a second, but Michael, you wrote an article called "What Should Black America Expect from a Black President?" Does it touch on these issues of identity at all, and on, you know, kind of basically is this our guy or is this not our guy.
Mr. BENNETT: The article, you mean?
CHIDEYA: Mmm-hmm.
Mr. BENNETT: Well, you know, we are a country of identities, and the point that I've been trying to make throughout this campaign is that rather than try to act like these identities don't exist, we ought to embrace them. You know, we respect each other's differences, but we embrace the uniqueness that exists within each different type of American.
And so the point that I'm trying to make is there are issues that are universal, that everybody seems to agree on are important - you know, Iraq, taxes, housing healthcare, that sort of thing. But there are also issues that are of unique importance to individual groups within the subculture of America. And so you would have Latinos, for example, who are much more interested in immigration that many Americans. You have Jews, for example, who are much more interested in Middle Eastern and Israeli policy than other Americans. and there are issues that of unique importance to African-Americans.
And so the point that I made in that column is, I think now, at this stage, given that he is the frontrunner with the most votes and the most delegates and all the momentum, and quite frankly more likely than anybody else to be the next president of the United States, I think it's all right to test the notion that the country is falling in line and unifying behind this guy by talking about some issues that don't often get any attention.
CHIDEYA: Wayne, what do you see ahead for the general election? If - and it's still an if, Barack Obama is the Democratic nominee, how are the Republicans, you think, going to play their card on race?
Mr. BENNETT: Oh, man. Well first of all, I'm always leery of what I call the Bradley effect. If the polls all - Rasmussen, USA Today, whatever - if they say Obama is 10 points up, it's even. If they say he's 10 points down, he's 20 points down. So you always have to be leery of these polls when you're talking about a minority candidate.
I think it's going to be very rough in the general. I know John McCain took the high road with the gentleman, Cunningham, yesterday, but I think his people in that movement are just not going to let Barack Obama - they're just not going to give him the ring.
I mean, they're going to - you see now, we're hearing his middle name more and more. We saw him in that Somalian elder's garb, on Drudge of all places, and I think it's just going to get very ugly before it gets any better. So I don't know if he's going to - I'm not ready to say he's going to win it yet. I think it's going to be very tough, and I think he's done a very good job. I have to give it to him so far, and...
CHIDEYA: Let me...
Mr. FOUNTROY: May I add something to that quickly, please?
CHIDEYA: I'm going to move on.
Mr. FOUNTROY: Okay.
CHIDEYA: I'm going to use my hostly prerogative.
(Soundbite of laughter)
CHIDEYA: We have one slight topic, and this is a speed round. I'm going to make you thumbs up or thumbs down. Last year in July, we spoke with NAACP chairman Julian Bond. Before I explain what we're going to, let's hear what he said.
Mr. JULIAN BOND (Chairman, NAACP): The fact is that if any organization precipitously loses its top official, then there are some moments of turmoil within the organization, and we certainly experienced some measures of turmoil. But we're on the road to recovery. We've got our fundraising apparatus in place, and I feel quite confident that within not the immediate future, but say six to nine months, we'll be back on solid ground once again.
CHIDEYA: They don't have a leader yet. It's been months, and this is a thumbs up, thumbs down. We don't have much time. I'm going to go through each of you. Will the NAACP have any impact on this election? Wayne?
Mr. BENNETT: Thumbs down. None.
CHIDEYA: Mike?
Mr. FOUNTROY: Down.
CHIDEYA: Debra?
Ms. DICKERSON: Down.
CHIDEYA: All right. Well, we've got the word on that. We could talk about it more, but we don't have time right now. This is our Bloggers' Roundtable. Thanks, guys.
Mr. BENNETT: Thank you.
Ms. DICKERSON: Thank you, Farai.
Mr. FOUNTROY: Thank you.
CHIDEYA: We've been talking with Debra Dickerson, author of the books "An American Story" and "The End of Blackness." She blogs at motherjones.com, and she was at member-station WAMC in Albany, New York. Also, attorney Wayne Bennett, who blogs as The Field Negro, he was at the Audio Post Studios in Philadelphia, and Michael Fauntroy, assistant professor of public policy at George Mason University, he blogs at michaelfountroy.com, and he was at our headquarters in Washington, D.C. You can find links to their blogs and ours at nprnewsandnotes.org.
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